While striving for accuracy in the 45-90, I have come to the conclusion that seating to the lands is very important is in my Sharps. But while doing so, I have been varying the roll crimp by some degree trying to find what is best. This is done in a seperate operation with my seating die. But now I have found a Lyman (I think) taper crimp die and I'm wondering if it might be better, in terms of a better crimp as well as increased brass life as it works more than just the lip. Has anyone used one and can offer some insight? Thanks for any replies...

Guns will vary, and while I'm shooting a long throat 45/70 Roller, have found with this rifle a minimal crimp has been working best.

Have an old 45/90 die that kind "kind of" taper crimp, the factory die that roll crimps, and an old Lyman 310 (tong tool) that rather abruptly crimps (if set to do so).

Shooting each type, the only "for sure" is that the abrupt crimp shoots worse. No crimp, slight roll crimp, or taper crimp all seems to shoot about the same...perhaps in a few thousand rounds a 1/5" difference would show up, but with a few hundered rounds shot, can't say with confidence any of them are better.

Recovering bullets with the abrupt roll crimp from the tong tool shows some evidence that the soft alloy is being gouged by the bullet before release. Haveing the turned in case mouth scrape the bullet sides for a short distance before releasing it doesn't seem to be doing much for accuracy.

So....I just turn the flare back to about level to get clean chambering, and leave it at that. The bullet is right at the rifling start...no pre engravemnt.

The times I tried light smokless loads seemed to prefer the roll crimp...but not a fair comparison as the alloy is harder.

There is an old 50/70 Roller here too. Between no-crimp and a light roll crimp, it prefers the roll crimp. Still palying with that one, and perhaps a change in alloy will change it's crimp preference...I'd prefer to get acceptable accuracy with no crimp is possible. Don't have a tper crimp die ( or one that makes a decent substitute).

Think you're going to have to do a shoot-off to find out what your rifle likes.

Thanks Mr. Ribbonstone, I was holding off buying the die until I got some positive feedback. Something like "Heck yes, that die makes ALL my rifles shoot into one hole!", but that may be awhile in coming. But I'm with you so far. I started seeing improvement as soon as I got it out to the lands. Then I got some new brass from Starline and I dropped the load down just to get the cases fire-formed. Darned if they didn't shoot as good as the warmer load I was so proud of! But I'm wondering if I'm not overworking the lip of the brass by expanding/crimping each time. I might just have to get the die and try it. Either way I'm having way too much fun shooting the old beast. Even built myself a gong yesterday, now have to build a stand for it. BONGGGGG

Learned my lesson about seating the bullets too far out in a roller. Only chambering force is your thumb, and if one hangs up just a hair, the hammer will expend it's energy seating the block (or refusing to fall at all) instead of smacking the primer. Even when the block looks closed and the hammer easily goes to 1/2 cock, may still have the hammer contact the block well before contacting the firing pin...can still go "bang" every time, but the groups suffer from inconsistant ignition

Same holds true for the fouling that can build up in the rim recess...gives the same effect..too little headspace.

The Sharps doesn't run on that system, and if you can get the action shut, it generally fires. MAy have some bad effects from tight/loose closing of the breech...kind of pre-stressing the action one shot, and no stress the next.

I'd certainly give minimal flare and then minimal crimp...just enough to get it to chamber cleanly even if still showing a tiny bit of flare.
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Have watched some small bore (32-40 and soem odd balls) shooters who swear by using a bullet that is the right size for the fired case and not sizing the case for 6 or 10 shots. Eventually the brass loses it's ability to "spring back" and they are forced to size it, but then it's good to go for another 1/2 dozen shots.

IN BP silhouette and long range target rifle shooting a crimp is not normally used. For confirmation just check those that stand in the winners circle. I do not resize my cases after firing. I do neck size about .5 inch using an old 45ACP taper crimp die which in conjunction with a modified neck expander and case mouth beller allows me to seat bullets without lead shaving. Unless the belled case mouth interfers with proper seating of the loaded cartridge in the chamber, I do not try to remove the bell, but if required just enough to allow easy chambering. Do not do anything that will allow mutilation of the bullet. There is a big difference between minute of buffalo and minute of angle at 1000 yards.