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Marshall Stanton
06-14-2004, 10:41 AM
At about the time our original 13 states adopted their new constitution, in
the year 1787, Alexander Tyler (a Scottish history professor at The
University of Edinborough) had this to say about "The Fall of The Athenian
Republic" some 2,000 years prior.

"A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a
permanent form of government. A democracy will continue to exist up until
the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts
from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for
the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with
the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal
policy, (which is) always followed by a dictatorship."

"The average age of the worlds greatest civilizations from the beginning of
history, has been about 200 years. During those 200 years, these nations
always progressed through the following sequence:

>From Bondage to spiritual faith;
>From spiritual faith to great courage;
>From courage to liberty;
>From liberty to abundance;
>From abundance to complacency;
>From complacency to apathy;
>From apathy to dependence;
>From dependence back into bondage."

Professor Joseph Olson of Hamline University School of Law, St. Paul,
Minnesota, points out some interesting facts concerning the most recent
Presidential election:

2000 Election Results Map
http://www.multied.com/elections/2000map.html (http://www.multied.com/elections/2000map.html)

Population of counties won by:
Gore=127 million
Bush=143 million

Square miles of land won by:
Gore=580,000
Bush=22,427,000

States won by:
Gore=19
Bush=29

Murder rate per 100,000 residents in counties won by:
Gore=13.2
Bush=2.1

Professor Olson adds:

"In aggregate, the map of the territory Bush won was mostly the land owned
by the tax-paying citizens of this great country. Gore's territory
encompassed those citizens living in government-owned tenements and living
off government welfare..."

Olson believes the U.S. is now somewhere between the "apathy" and
"complacency" phase of Professor Tyler's definition of democracy; with some
40 percent of the nation's population already having reached the
"governmental dependency" phase.

Rmouleart
06-14-2004, 11:48 AM
Very intresting Marshal. You learn something new everyday if you want to ;) Aim small hit small. RAMbo.

kdub
06-14-2004, 01:26 PM
You can just about see it coming, can't you?

Since the Great Depression, the American public has voted for those (starting with Roosevelt) who promised more welfare and subsidy than the other guy. The value of the dollar plummented, federal and local taxes skyrocketed and Middle America has taken it right in the pocketbook and rear end.

At the same time, those fearing we gun owners might rebel against further taxation have passed progressively restricting gun control measures so we can't shoot back! :D

DOK
06-14-2004, 01:40 PM
Sure wish I had an intelligent rebuttal, but I sure don't.

Dan

NRALIFE
06-14-2004, 04:19 PM
You can surely see the writing on the wall!!!
Scary!!

Bill M
06-14-2004, 05:31 PM
"In aggregate, the map of the territory Bush won was mostly the land owned
by the tax-paying citizens of this great country. Gore's territory
encompassed those citizens living in government-owned tenements and living
off government welfare..."

Looks like the left and the right have choosen up sides and each has a plan to win. The left wants to win by destroying freedom and the right wants to win by ... well, at least talking about freedom. It strikes me that the rarest of jems is in men and women who want to lead with Biblical integrity... and have the charisma & drive to cut thru the muck.

I so miss Ronald Regan. Love him or hate him, he was a great man and truly a man of God. He taught us we can be more than we think.. that we can be more free and the impossible really is possible. He, like the founding fathers preached that more government is our enemy and less govt is our friend.

A democracy is a dream. When the dream dies, so does the democracy. Our country is a long way down the path to bondage. I, for one, choose to belive in the dream and not let go.

Bill

ombesb
06-14-2004, 05:40 PM
Stunning!! Real people know most of that in bits and pieces, but to see it all together is something else. And it's fitting us like clockwork.

white dog
06-14-2004, 08:27 PM
thanks marshall for putting that one in. i have felt that for a long time but now i can put it in words whitedog

Bigfoot
06-15-2004, 02:13 AM
I think this is, along with lack of faith in God, the true danger to our society.

J Miller
06-15-2004, 07:54 AM
Marshall,

A very scary time line that's as clear as a flow chart.

Hope you don't mind I posted your comments and a link to the thread over at Handloads.Com forum. I also emailed it to a bunch of folks I know.

Joe

Loader 3009
06-15-2004, 01:59 PM
Yet, some people refuse to accept this as truth. Several months ago, I Emailed that article to an newspaper editor. He wrote back, "Don't hand me that garbage."

wannablast
06-19-2004, 07:37 PM
Please don't close this thread and say it ain't going nowhere good.

M1894
06-19-2004, 08:29 PM
Loader: The only problem with this thread is that it is preaching to the Choir. Too bad that the newspaper editor had a closed mind.

Lee L.

WAGNER95696
06-19-2004, 11:07 PM
Normal inflation causes all currencies to lose some value over time. What matters is how one currency fares relative to the others. The USA has done pretty well in the last 70 years. In almost every case the exchange rates vis a vis almost any country in the world has improved in our favor.

I recommend the book 'It's Getting Better All the Time', by Stephen Moore & Julian Simon. 2000, Cato Institute.

Sometimes it is difficult to accurately judge how much progress we have really made because our terms of reference are constantl;y moving.

El Lobo
06-20-2004, 11:00 AM
Hey Guys,

I've been saying for years that there will be a war in this country between those who sit on their butts, hands out waiting for the next gov't check, and those who work their butts off to payroll the gov't. I expect those who are used to working hard will win.

That those in Washington are so self-centered that they will not do what is right for the country (note I did not say people) just wears me out. The opportunities our great great grandfathers had our great great grandchildren will not.

Lobo in West Virginia

KO cap
06-20-2004, 08:19 PM
"every Kingdom divided against itself is bought to desolation;and a house divided against a house falleth.Lk 11:17