I have been reading about barrel break in for a while now and it seems most people lean against it for use on a hunting rifle. I have to say I somewhat agree with the majority that on a FACTORY HUNTING RIFLE BARREL it probably won't make a noticable difference. Well I'm sure most of you have read about my problems with the BLR I purchased and how it was resolved. Well I have ordered from cabela's 100rds of .308 that are loaded with 165gr speer btsp. I should get this order sometime this weekend. Back to my point I have read a lot about breaking in a rifle but never seen someone post results on a run of the mil hunting rifle. Well, I'm gonna do just that. Here's the plan:

Gun: Browning BLR '81 lightweight in .308 NIB will be cleaned before taking to the range.

Scope: Bushnell Elite 3200 3x9x40mm

Shooter: me, Average shooting skills, I can get clover leaves out of my BAR when I shoot my best and that is the goal with this gun. (I may be shooting for the stars but we will see)

Shooting platform: Solid concrete bench, will not move. I will put the gun into a solid rest that locks down the forearm and the but of the rifle to minimize movement and ensure even pressure on forearm through entire process. Gun will not come out of the vise/rest durring etire test.

Shooting conditions: I'm in Alabama so its going to be Hot 80-low 90s with high humidity. I'll try to only shoot when the wind is as calm as possible.

Range: 100yds.


Break in plan:
Like I stated before I will deeply clean the gun before going to the range. I have it bore sighted so it should be on paper at least at 100yds. I will fire a two shot group to see where I hit on paper and then make scope adjustments to get as close as possible to bullseye at 100yds. I will then shoot a four shot group out of the gun and measure for group size. You can consider my first two shots fouling shots. After that here comes the break in. Noted I will always allow for barrel cool down time.

Step One
For the first 10 shots I will fire one shot and then clean the barrel.

Step Two:
Then I will move to fireing 2 shots and then cleaning. I will do this 10 times for a total of 20 rounds fired in step two.

Step Three:
Now I will move up to shooting three shots, cleaning and repeating this 10 times for a total of 30 shots fired.

Step Four:
I will fire four shots at a time and then clean. I will do this 5 times for a total of 20 shots in step four.

Step Five:
I will fire two five shot groups cleaning between each group for a total of 10 shots fired in step five.

Step Six:
This should leave me with 4 bullets. After making sure the barrel is as clean as possible and completely cooled down I will fire one last four shot group and measure to compare to the first group.

I will post back my results, some may think I'm wasting my time but I can't call any time behind a rifle wasted. If nothing at all I'm getting a lot of practice with trigger pull, breathing, and sight picture. My shoulder will be pretty sore though. I'm gonna try and get a shooting pad before hand to try and help that out.

That sounds like a long day, when you account for cooling time. I am interested in the results, though.

If that's gonna be your game plan - can't hurt a thing by using it.

Only suggestion I'd make is to start at 25 yds and get the group centered dead center before moving out to 100 yds - think you'll be much happier with the zeroing process.

I have tried it on factory guns out of the box with no luck at all. Aint much you can do with a BAR to help it out side of a trigger job. Either it shoots or it dont. Although I have never seen one that wouldnt shoot Im sure there have been some somewhere. But hey it's a good exscuse to spend the day at the range shooting. And that much practice with the gun will probly help your accuracy more then the rifles.

Worth a try. Save your targets, might make a good tech note.

I normally clean after every round for the first five then every other for ten .
Use JB bore compound about every third cleaning afterwards , couldn't see a noticeable difference . But I'm a clean freak anyway . I can spend thiry minutes cleaning after one shot . Good Therapy.

I personally don't bother breaking in a barrel, I just try to keep from overheating it. As long as you're having fun, that's all that counts.

Finally got my ammo shipped to me. Weather permiting I'll do my test tommorow. We'll see.

Finally got my ammo shipped to me. Weather permiting I'll do my test tommorow. We'll see.

Won't proove much...even if you just shot the devil out of it without the cleaning sessions carefully spaced, it would show improvment the next time out. New rifles tend to wear in...part of it is bore, part of it is matting the mainspring, trigger, bedding, etc. Hard to seperate all the factors. You won't hurt it by following the break-in schedual...but the improvment may well have happened even if you just shot it and cleaned it at random.

I personally don't mess with what works...for a standard weight hunting rifle, if it groups well and doesn't collect fouling too quickly, I'll just leave it alone. Excessive fouling is never a real problem in the field for a big game rifle...you won't be shooting 20 or 30 shots in a hunt...it is a problem for the range where you may shoot more than that.

If you shoot 6 shots before the first cleaning, you might as well start in step five. Breaking-in is to do things before shooting a lot, not after.
And I disagree with you that a standard factory rifle is the least improved by this. It is quite the opposite. Factory (cheap) barrels have the most to gain. My $.02.

If you shoot 6 shots before the first cleaning, you might as well start in step five. Breaking-in is to do things before shooting a lot, not after.
And I disagree with you that a standard factory rifle is the least improved by this. It is quite the opposite. Factory (cheap) barrels have the most to gain. My $.02.

"Like I stated before I will deeply clean the gun before going to the range."


The gun was cleaned prior to the first 6 shots. I'll be posting my results

Mattpair,
If it makes you happy, go for it! Just please post your findings, as we may learn something (that IS a good thing). I tend to think it helps in the long run. Just my opinion.
Peace be with you, Doug

Hi Guy`s,

I don`t go to the extreme you are going to but the one thing I have noticed the most in the guns that I have broken in is they clean up much better than one thats new or has been abused.I normaly go to the range with a totaly clean barrel and do my shooting then clean to bare metal before i go back out.after a couple trips to the range I do notice a differince.I also shoot the first bullet in the barrel with a light coat of oil it helps with the copper fouling.

One thing that helps with the cleaning of the barrel is JB bore paste.It gets the last bit of fouling out while deburing the ruff spots in the barrelWhen you do as much cleaning as you will have to do in one day it will save you a lot of time.

riflemen10x

Hey guys. Thought I'd through a line or two at yall tonight. This test is taking much longer than I thought. I spent 3 hours at the range wed. 3 hours today and I will be there tommorow trying to finish up. I'm keeping detailed notes in a journal, saving all the targets I can. (one got rained on before I could get to it). Don't want to let the cat out of the bag yet, but things are looking good. I look forward to giving a full report this saturday or sunday. (IF I get done).

I realize you already started, but the gist of my note is that what you're trying to achieve by cleaning after every shot for the first 10 (?) shots is to avoid accumulation of copper and powder, which gets ironed onto the inside of the barrel easier on those first shots.

I realize that you want to compare the grouping ability of a barrel not broken-in, against one that is broken-in. It can't be done with the same barrel. The barrel break-in procedure has to start with the first shots. Hopefully you'll still get an improvement with your procedure.

Best of luck to you on your experiment. I'll be waiting for your results.

That sounds like a long day, when you account for cooling time. I am interested in the results, though.

If it was done in one day, it would have been a really long day :)

In my humble opinion, this is the most time consuming solution to a non-existant problem. Shoot your new gun 15-20 rounds and clean it with sweet's 7.62, and if it has a lot of copper in it you'll see it come out on the patches as a really dark blue goop.

I tried this one shot and clean it method on a new 25 cal Krieger barrel two years ago never did see any copper come out. After about 5 times I digressed to once every 20 or so and never had more than a tiny bit of copper come out.
When I first shot a new Lilja barrel this spring I immediately went 20 rounds before the first cleaning, and didn't see hardly any cooper come out. Although both of these custom guns are very accurate, neither is quite as good as my Cooper.

I never did "breakin" my Cooper 21 which now has over 1000 rounds through it , and last Wednesday I had to settle a score with a guy on my trap shooting team who said 223's aren't accurate pas 200 yards. The Cooper did a .75 inch, a 1.125 inch and a 1.75 inch group at 300 yards.
How much better is it possible for a gun to shoot that hasn't been broke-in?"

I didn't vote on the pole. I do break barrels in but not for accuracy reasons. I do it to polish, especially the throat.

I don't own many rifles with premium barrels but I do own a few and I can assure you that both Krieger and Lilja recommend "fire one shot and clean" break-in procedures.

It's a very simple equation for me....the time and money invested in the collecting of components, deciding on what options or additional machine work is desired and finally getting it all put together...you can bet that if Krieger says break it in...I'm gonna break it in.

The next logical step for me....if it's good for a finish lapped premium barrel, it might be worth while on all barrels.

I have been reading about barrel break in for a while now and it seems most people lean against it for use on a hunting rifle. I have to say I somewhat agree with the majority that on a FACTORY HUNTING RIFLE BARREL it probably won't make a noticable difference. Well I'm sure most of you have read about my problems with the BLR I purchased and how it was resolved. Well I have ordered from cabela's 100rds of .308 that are loaded with 165gr speer btsp. I should get this order sometime this weekend. Back to my point I have read a lot about breaking in a rifle but never seen someone post results on a run of the mil hunting rifle. Well, I'm gonna do just that. Here's the plan:

Gun: Browning BLR '81 lightweight in .308 NIB will be cleaned before taking to the range.

Scope: Bushnell Elite 3200 3x9x40mm

Shooter: me, Average shooting skills, I can get clover leaves out of my BAR when I shoot my best and that is the goal with this gun. (I may be shooting for the stars but we will see)

Shooting platform: Solid concrete bench, will not move. I will put the gun into a solid rest that locks down the forearm and the but of the rifle to minimize movement and ensure even pressure on forearm through entire process. Gun will not come out of the vise/rest durring etire test.

Shooting conditions: I'm in Alabama so its going to be Hot 80-low 90s with high humidity. I'll try to only shoot when the wind is as calm as possible.

Range: 100yds.


Break in plan:
Like I stated before I will deeply clean the gun before going to the range. I have it bore sighted so it should be on paper at least at 100yds. I will fire a two shot group to see where I hit on paper and then make scope adjustments to get as close as possible to bullseye at 100yds. I will then shoot a four shot group out of the gun and measure for group size. You can consider my first two shots fouling shots. After that here comes the break in. Noted I will always allow for barrel cool down time.

Step One
For the first 10 shots I will fire one shot and then clean the barrel.

Step Two:
Then I will move to fireing 2 shots and then cleaning. I will do this 10 times for a total of 20 rounds fired in step two.

Step Three:
Now I will move up to shooting three shots, cleaning and repeating this 10 times for a total of 30 shots fired.

Step Four:
I will fire four shots at a time and then clean. I will do this 5 times for a total of 20 shots in step four.

Step Five:
I will fire two five shot groups cleaning between each group for a total of 10 shots fired in step five.

Step Six:
This should leave me with 4 bullets. After making sure the barrel is as clean as possible and completely cooled down I will fire one last four shot group and measure to compare to the first group.

I will post back my results, some may think I'm wasting my time but I can't call any time behind a rifle wasted. If nothing at all I'm getting a lot of practice with trigger pull, breathing, and sight picture. My shoulder will be pretty sore though. I'm gonna try and get a shooting pad before hand to try and help that out.


The barrel will get easier to clean, especially if you use flitz in between the change on the 10 cleaning cycle. The reason your groups will not shrink is you will be tired.

Fifteen or so years ago, gun writer, Ross Seifried, writing for "Guns and Ammo" I believe, started the barrel break-in procedure. In his article he gave detailed instructions as how to break in a new barrel. The same manner in which we read about breaking in a barrel today. Shoot and clean, shoot and clean..... The magazine was flooded with readers questions, replys and responces over the next several week period. Seifried finally had to come clean and admit to writing the article out of the thin air with no grounds to support his claims.

Fast forward. I guess many did not read his retraction and still take his initial article as gospel.

I see no reason or need to break-in a barrel. Normal shooting will acomplish the same objective, saving barrel wear, time and much ammo dollars. ;)

Remember, don't shoot your barrel too hot and, you can do more harm with a cleaning rod than good.

Up and Down range,
GW

Fifteen or so years ago, gun writer, Ross Seifried, writing for "Guns and Ammo" I believe, started the barrel break-in procedure. In his article he gave detailed instructions as how to break in a new barrel. The same manner in which we read about breaking in a barrel today. Shoot and clean, shoot and clean..... The magazine was flooded with readers questions, replys and responces over the next several week period. Seifried finally had to come clean and admit to writing the article out of the thin air with no grounds to support his claims.

Fast forward. I guess many did not read his retraction and still take his initial article as gospel.

I see no reason or need to break-in a barrel. Normal shooting will acomplish the same objective, saving barrel wear, time and much ammo dollars. ;)

Remember, don't shoot your barrel too hot and, you can do more harm with a cleaning rod than good.

Up and Down range,
GW

Sorry to be so long guys, Just been covered up at work. I should get to finish the whole thing by middle of next week. I appreciate all the comments, keep 'em comming the more comments the more I will have to write about when it is all said and done.

Hi all,
I've started all of my new rifles with the "shoot one, clean" method for the first 10 rounds. Then I clean after every five for the next 20. After that I clean as close to bare metal as I can and then clean every 20 rounds or so (hunting type rifles, match guns vary depending) or at the end of the session (plinkers). Accuracy improvements? Really haven't noticed. But even trying this with "new" used rifles usually results in a barrel that's easier to get clean.
Good shooting,
HP

If there is a truth here...I can't find it. I'm sure many of you have researched the old barrel break-in question before and finally just did what you thought best.

Gale McMillan gives credit for the break-in fad to a fellow barrel maker. (you can find McMillan at Firing Line forum)

Some barrel makers recommend the procedure, others do not. Some say it only accelerates wear, others claim it smooths the bore faster.

I can't find any credible information on the improvement of accuracy...no hard data seems to exist to support any such claims.

There might be some truth (and I say might) to the claim of smoothing the surfaces faster.

If I had to give an opinion on the subject after all the reading I have done it would be:

Most of us break-in gurus are probably full of poo.
I'm still gonna do it because I'm hard headed but maybe I better find a good recipe for crow.

Not so quick on the crow. Who's to know who is right on this one. There is no way to test the procedure cause once the barrel is "broken in" it can't be "un-broken in" to do it the other way.
Perhaps the best we can do on this one is to agree to disagree but for Heaven's sake, no crows on the dinner table :D
Up and down range....
GeoW

My FFL dealer and shooting buddy says he has tested this on new rifles, and swears by the break-in. He says the idea is to smooth out the tiny irregularities and sweep out the miniscule bits of metal that rifling leaves behind. It also makes the barrel smoother and less likely to foul. He used a pair of unfired military rifles with bores that appeared identical, and claims the difference is that the "cleaned" one will shoot into an inch at 200 yards, the other shoots into about 3" with ammo it likes, but it's pretty fussy about ammo. The other is much less so.

All I know is, he's the only guy I've ever seen with military rifles that shoot as well as his do, and all his "Shooters" came to him unfired!

Papajohn the former un-believer

The whole barrel break in thing is a bunch of bull , If you use up 2% of the barrel life in break in then the barrel maker sells 2% more barrels and thats how it started !
The cleaning rod improperly used has ruined many barrels and JB bore paste Should only be used as a last ditch effort to restore the bore of a rifle bought used and not properly cared for . JB is a abrasive paste and the first thing it wears on is the sharp edge of the rifleling .
Testing of the breakin procedure on a handfull of rifles proves nothing , Nobody is going to sacrifice enough barrels to prove a method and then the method would change on each variation of barrel material ,caliber and possibly twist rate .
Whos to say if you do see a improvement it woulnt happen if you didnt clean between groups ?
My method is to clean a new barrel and then shoot as normal

Wow! People feel really strongly about this. Wonder why? I know 1000yd bench rest shooters that clean a lot. Almost a constant break in procedure for those guys just to shoot those little groups. Lots have gone to Wipe Out now to get the copper out when it starts to cause groups to spread. Most use a paste cleaner, scrubber at the end of the day. They don't care how fast they wear out a barrel and what they call worn or shot out I could still hunt with from now on and not know the difference.

It is all relative I guess. Oh! I will be doing the lap job on my 1894 with the prize I won in the Postal Match. That will take care of any break in procedure I did on that gun.

We have to just agree to disagree on this cleaning thing. Always remember,"The more you think you know, the less you know." That is my daily reminder because most times I think I am right and I have to be reminded that more than I want to admit, I am wrong.

I realize that you want to compare the grouping ability of a barrel not broken-in, against one that is broken-in. It can't be done with the same barrel. The barrel break-in procedure has to start with the first shots. Hopefully you'll still get an improvement with your procedure.

If that is the case, then no barrel can be "broken in" if it came on a factory rifle, as they are all fired at the factory.

IMO all this barrel break in stuff is going to go down as one of the biggest jokes ever played on the American shooter, at least in regards to anything but the best target/match grade barrels. Certainly no run of the mill "factory" barrel qualifies for that. IMO the only one who benefits from barrel break in is the ammo maker.

I get more improvement using moly fusion after the frst brick and a deep cleaning. almost no copper buildup after that and the first 500 rounds pretty much serve to lap the barrel smooth.

Well guys, good news and bad news.

I finally finished my break in yesterday afternoon, learned a lot. I kept detailed notes on each of the 100 rds and all of my groups and cleaning sessions. Heres the good news.........
My first groups were about 3 1/2 inches at 100yds and left the barrel extremely dirty. Over the course of the barrel break in the barrel got easier to clean as expected and could go a little longer without needing to be cleaned, ie at first the barrel was filthy after 1 rd. It can now go 5 before it needs to be cleaned. This whole proccess took about 3 weeks and a lot of range sessions. I bought a recoil pad to wear and that helped out a good bit. Here's the bad news.......................
My groups were very inconsistant. They generally were getting smaller, but my POI would change significantly with each group, normally 2 to 3 inches difference in POI from group to group. After I finished the break in I susspected my scope might be the whole problem. It is a brand new Bushnell elite 3200 3x9x40mm, not a top of the line Leupold, but not a cheapo either. Well I sat a target at 50yds and attempted to "shoot the box" First shot dead center 2 inches low. Moved 7 clicks right which should have moved the bullet 3.5 inches to the left. Fired Second shot, hit 1 inch low and 1/2'' right. Moved 7 clicks down, again this should have moved the bullet 3.5 inches down. Third bullet hit 2 inches low and 1 inch left. Moved 7 clicks left, which should have moved the bullet 3.5" left and fired. 4th shot his 2.25" low and .5" left. Moved 7 clicks up which should have moved the bullet up 3.5" and back to where the original bullet hit. Shot landed .5" low and .25" left. NONE of the shots hit where they should of. In fact instead of a 3.5" box I got what looked like a decent 100yd group. I was really really frustrated. I spent so much time doing this and the whole time my scope was junk. I really can't report on any of the data I collected because the scope being off means that none of the group sizes matter. I took the scope off and cleaned the gun. Took the bases off and loaded up two rounds to fire at 50yds. Both struck 3 inches high and touched each other. Now I have to contact Bushnell to see if I can get my money back.

This is not a bench gun, it will never be a bench gun.Your scopeis fine. My own Belgian blr will shoot 4 rounds from a cold barrel in onne hole. Then the fun begins. Groups grow. It holds to Moa till around round 20 then forget it. It will still stay on a 8 inch papaerplate but thats it. Hunting rifle accuracy and a **** good one.

Buy a bull barreled bolt gun if you want to shoot one hole over prolonged firing.

Shooting the box out of a Blr is not going to work. You need a real rest, a real "accurate rifle" and a real good trigger skills. your HEARTBEAT ALONE ON A SLOWLOCKTIME BLR SCREWS THE POOCH.

Sorry to bust your bubble but this is not going to ever get to the point you will be happy.

Best to you MAtt


oh your poi figures are correct for 50 yards.

I had the same problem but I used my Bushnell that I bought for my 25 cal Air rifle not a cheap gun ($1200.00) I set the scope up and same thing no two shots were the same and the scope would not track for beans...so I put my 6.5x20 Lupy back on just to make sure and sure enough one hole groups @ 30 yards. Anyways Bushnell is a joke and a waste of time they are pure JUNK! you could probably send it back to get repared then dump it on Ebay or something but once it's mounted in rings they usually will not take them back. After you get rid of it take a look on ebay therte are alot of great deals on lupys ...alot of people will have different oppinions on this but don't waste your time with anything else other than say a Nightforce or Zeiss, Swarovski (Spelling ?) USO they are pricy but the glass is the most important part of the package.
Good luck Keith

This is not a bench gun, it will never be a bench gun.Your scopeis fine. My own Belgian blr will shoot 4 rounds from a cold barrel in onne hole. Then the fun begins. Groups grow. It holds to Moa till around round 20 then forget it. It will still stay on a 8 inch papaerplate but thats it. Hunting rifle accuracy and a **** good one.

Buy a bull barreled bolt gun if you want to shoot one hole over prolonged firing.

Shooting the box out of a Blr is not going to work. You need a real rest, a real "accurate rifle" and a real good trigger skills. your HEARTBEAT ALONE ON A SLOWLOCKTIME BLR SCREWS THE POOCH.

Sorry to bust your bubble but this is not going to ever get to the point you will be happy.

Best to you MAtt


oh your poi figures are correct for 50 yards.


Doc, I got to disagree with you. My scope has 1/4" clicks @ 100yds. If I shoot at fifty yds and the Ffrst is shot dead center 2 inches low. Then moved 7 clicks right. My next shot should be 3.5 inchs right and 2 inches low, one click equaling .5inch at 50yds. Well I Fired the Second shot, and it hit 1 inch low and 1/2'' right. Reread my post none of the adjustments I made with the scope worked out on paper. I took the scope off and the gun shot one ragged hole @ 50yds. I still think the scope is messed up internally. The gun was being shot out of a Cadwell rest with virtually now wind.

I had the same problem but I used my Bushnell that I bought for my 25 cal Air rifle not a cheap gun ($1200.00)


Spring-piston airguns recoil forward and will shake apart most scopes in short order, unless they are made for airguns, FYI.

Doc, I got to disagree with you. My scope has 1/4" clicks @ 100yds. If I shoot at fifty yds and the Ffrst is shot dead center 2 inches low. Then moved 7 clicks right. My next shot should be 3.5 inchs right and 2 inches low, one click equaling .5inch at 50yds. Well I Fired the Second shot, and it hit 1 inch low and 1/2'' right. Reread my post none of the adjustments I made with the scope worked out on paper. I took the scope off and the gun shot one ragged hole @ 50yds. I still think the scope is messed up internally. The gun was being shot out of a Cadwell rest with virtually now wind.

If a click is 1/4" at 100 yards, it is 1/8" at 50 yards, not 1/2". It will move your point of aim by 1/2" at 200 yards. It is proportional, so when you double your shooting distance (ie 200 yds compared to 100 yds), you also double the distance of your point of impact adjustments. By this same proportion, if you halved the distance to the target (ie 50 yds compared to 100 yds), you also halve the distance of your point of impact adjustments. So it's a half of a quarter, which is the same as 1/8".

So, your 7 clicks should have moved it less than an inch (7/8") at 50 yards, not 3.5". This could explain why it looked like a decent 100 yard group. Keep in mind that paralax will also come into play, especially at distances under 100 yards. At 25 yards, if I don't adjust the paralax on my 270, I can easily get +/- .5" of movement left or right depending on which angle I look through the scope at.

I would suggest that before you pack up the scope to ship it back, try this. Shoot a fouling shot or two out of a clean barrel. Let it cool. Then shoot a 3 shot group at 50 yards with your sights. Doubling this group size should give you an idea of what your rifle should be doing at 100 yards. Then, try remounting your scope and making absolutely sure that everything is tight and use some nail polish or loctite. As long as you're on the paper, go ahead and shoot a couple 3-shot groups with the scope at 100 yards. Try to be as consistent as possible and take out as many variables as possible. Clean the barrel the same way. Then foul the barrel first, then let it cool. Shoot a group. Let it cool and shoot another group. If your groups are well more than double the size of your 50 yd open-sight group, or they are still wandering all over the place, then it is probably your scope.

Hope this helps.

Ditto Amndouglas. Those 7 clicks = .875".

BTW, I doubt factories shoot more that 2 shots through a barrel in testing, not 6.

Ditto Amndouglas. Those 7 clicks = .875".

BTW, I doubt factories shoot more that 2 shots through a barrel in testing, not 6.


Well guys, thanks for correcting me. Wish I hadn't pulled that scope off. Answer me this though, my POI changed pretty significantly after each cleaning sometimes just an inch sometimes 3 inches off. I never changed ammo or did anything else that I could see changing my POI. This is another reason I think the scope may be messed up.

If you fire the last 4 shots from a freshly cleaned barrel you might get a flier on the first. I usually clean after extedned practice but fire a couple rounds to foul before I go hunting. My first shot from a cleaned barrel doesn't usually group with the rest.

You had two foul shots before the first group. Maybe you could save a round from the breakin and foul the barrel before the 4 shot group.

Well guys, thanks for correcting me. Wish I hadn't pulled that scope off. Answer me this though, my POI changed pretty significantly after each cleaning sometimes just an inch sometimes 3 inches off. I never changed ammo or did anything else that I could see changing my POI. This is another reason I think the scope may be messed up.

You've got me on that one. I've never owned a brand new rifle, so I don't know if that's typical behavior, but it doesn't make sense to me. I did help my brother sight in his new Savage, and we didn't have any problems with the groups moving (at least not significantly). The groups would move, but it would make sense because it would be in the direction of the wind that day.

As far as cleaning goes, I've shot at least 50 rounds in my 270 without cleaning, and there wasn't a noticable difference in accuracy while shooting prairie dogs at 200+ yards. You want to talk about a filthy barrel. I pushed out countless blue and purple patches with hoppes benchrest and finally Wipe Out. In my opinion, granted I'm no expert, the entire group shouldn't move 3 inches just from cleaning. A shot or two, maybe, but not the whole group. And 3 inches is a bit extreme. My first flyer in my 308 would still be within an inch of the other 2 shots, which were pretty well right on the money.

More than likely, it is your scope or your mounts. I was just trying to help you find out if it was something else. I know I wouldn't want to be without a scope that I paid good money for, not to mention losing confidence in my setup, if there was some easy fix for it.

Hopefully your frustrations with your new rifle will end here. Best of luck.

amndouglas

amndouglas

Thanks for all the input. This whole process has been, well, a learning process for me. I've gotten to know this gun a lot better. I do feel that the change in POI I experienced is enough to call Bushnell about, I just don't have 100% confiedence in the scope and for me that is a must. I plan on contacting Bushnell tommorow and trying to send the scope back to them. Glad I filled out the warrenty card. If they won't work with me as a last resort I can always sell it on EBay. I've always had either Leupold or Burris scopes and never had any problem with them. This little adventure in Bushnell land may be enough to keep me buying Luepies and Burris.

Hey guys, this was an intersting thread, where I got a lot of oppinions from folks and learned a lot in the process. I just wanted to leave a few comments to let everyone know what happened with my break in.
As you might have seen in the earlier post, I was having problems with shifting POI. I took the scope off the rifle and sent it to Bushnell. They confirmed that the scope had failed. They didn't ever tell me just what had gone wrong with the scope, just that it had failed and they were going to cut me a check for 100% of my purchase price, tax and all, good Customer Service.
Due to the scope problems I had, really all the data I collected kinda goes out the window. There is no 100% way to tell if my groups were shrinking, I kept all my targets, and kept a detailed report on where each bullet landed. To sum things up, my groups did appear to get smaller. The first groups I was getting were about 3 inches on average. Now with the right load I can get almost 1 inch, mostly 1.25" @ 100yds with the right load. The biggest thing I noticed was at first how quickly the barrel was to foul. After just 3 shots the barrel was filthy and heavly fouled. Over the break in process this has gotten much better. I had to do a lot of cleaning durring this test, lots of elbow grease. One lesson learned, BUY YOU A CAN OF WIPE-OUT!. This stuff is great, just can't say enough about it, it reduces cleaning time and effort so much. Also a good spoting scope is very handy, my range let me borrow one each day I was out there. I guess the big question is would I do this again with a new rifle? Yes, even if the accuracy only picked up a little, I think this process really helps to smooth out the bore, which helps in cleaning. I still think my BLR could use a good lapping job, but that will have to be sometime in the future. The actual shooting of the process took me over 3 weeks. And then I had to wait to get the news from Bushnell and then I had to buy a new scope to verify how it was shooting. (I bought a 2.5x8 VX-III) I'm getting good groups, 1.25" @ 100yds. Really a Good improvement from my first group, but I'm not sure if that doesn't have something to do with the new scope compared to the Bushnell that crapped out on mel I'm happy with the gun and feel good about the break-in process. When I buy my nest gun, (probably a Bolt-action Browning or Tikka) I believe I will be doing a breakin on it also. Thanks to everyone that voted and took time to give me their view on this highly contraversal subject.

To each his own.

Matt