Hi,I had the pleasure of finding this site on Saturday and spent much of the day reading past threads.I'm very interested in building a smooth bore slug/buckshot shotgun.I read all the past post buy James Gates and also was lucky enough to find his great web-site.I live in NJ(unfortunatley for me)which is a shotgun only state.I've worked in gun stores in NJ for the past 20 years.I've seen alot and heard alot more.I like a simple basic approach to things including firearms.I enjoyed Mr.Gates ideas and some others of you who belive basic is better.I'm interested in building a smooth bore buckshot/slug gun,I'don't like sabots,I don't shoot far,I want to drop the animal as quickly as posible.If I start with a Remington 870 Express,whats next,sights;ghost ring,fiber optic or red dot(I do consider those sisht basic).Next choke;tubes or a poly-choke?Stock,the 870 Express deer gun comes with a monte-carlo stock,I think,is it to high?Would a wood stock be better as it's a little bit heavier and I could but in a mercury recoil damper,do they work?Any suggestions?
Mr. Gates and others also poste about ataching a rifled slug barrel to an 870 via epoxy,what about an Ithaca Deerslayer II?
Mr.Gates,sir whats your suggetion on a muzzle loader using the same approch that you use in shotguns.
Thankyou all for your time and help.I'm looking foward to hopefully reading your respones to my question,BASIC.

Hello Brother Basic!
It doesn't matter where you live, keep your gun simple. Now, here's my suggestion:
Buy a Remington 870 Express (synthetic stocks) slug gun with a 20" smoothbore slug barrel with sights. Send the barrel up to Mike Orlen and have him thread the barrel for Remington tubes. He does everything on centers and impact will not change,
Now, at this point you have a choice....either to buy a set of Remington tubes (mainly Full & Improved Cylinder) or buy a Vent Polychoke II (this I like) that screws into the threads. Set the gun up for a sling. You might want to replace the sights with Tru-Glo. This setup handles both birdshot, buckshot, and slugs....depending on what choke tube or setting.
To stick in the barrel on the pump guns...wipe off the barrel extension (the part that goes inside the frame) and the inside of the frame (where to barrel goes in) with acetone. Really give it a good wiping! Mix your Brownells Acraglas-Gel and add some powdered steel (about 1/3 the amount of Gel). Wipe a little inside the frame where the barrel goes in and on the barrel extension. It does not take a lot. Put the barrel in and pull up the magazine cap tight. Check the inside to see if any excess has squeezed out around the barrel extension inside the frame, if so wipe out. Let it set up for a day or two, leaving the bolt back, action open. This sets up good and we have not shot a test gun loose. When cleaning the gun, pull the trigger group, holding it muzzle down, hose it out with brake cleaner, then wipe out the barrel. Wipe everything down, inside and out, with oily rag.
At Dixie Slugs, we make a round designed for a setup like this called the Predator. It is a full size .730"-563 gr hard cast, heat treated, hollow base slug. We vibrate Superfine grade Moly into it for lube. We put a pure wool 20 ga. wad into the hollow base to keep any filler wads from blowing into it. In testing factory Foster slugs, we found over half of the recovered slugs had wads blown into their bases. You might see a black smear in the barrel.....it's not lead, but Moly. It can be wiped out with acetone.
Sight your gun in at 75 yards......it will be on at 25 yards, about 2" high at 50 yards, and about 3" low at 100 yards.
We are now shipping our slugs loaded with a new all weather, cold or hot, powder.
I hope this answers some of your questions......James

Mr. Gates,sir,thankyou for your response.Yes sir it does answer my questions,I hope to be ordering some of your slugs soon and will contact Mr.Orlen.Thankyou again,BASIC.

Basic & All......Some clarification.....I am not against sabot, lightweight, etc. slugs...they amy have there placed. We tested a 1 3/8 oz slug that is advertised as a dangerous game slug. It was supposed to be hard. It was in a fancy box. Part of its weight was the attached large plastic wad.
But, it still leaded the barrel and we were not impressed with it penetration. The terminator Slug is 1.69 oz, very nere 1 3/4 oz (1.75 oz).......a very heavy slug. There is no attached plastic wad. The Predator weighs 563 grs (1.29 oz), just over 1 1/4 oz. When you compare these weights with the original .45-70 load of 500 grs at 1250.....you begin to see the reason these slugs hit hard.
Dixie Slugs designs slugs for heavy (and dangerous) game in normal hunting ranges (swamps and woodland) out to 100 yards. That does not mean the will not kill at longer ranges though. If your hunting conditions force longer shots, try some of the lightweight slugs.
However, Dixie Slugs is dedicated to supply the hunters a series of hard hitting, deep penetrating slugs.
Also, we are not against slug bolt guns, etc.......but rather lean toward fast action pump guns for close cover.....James

Mr. Gates

You may have answered the following query in one of your other most educational posts. If so, please excuse the repetition.

My query relates to rifled choke tubes. Have you tried either the Terminator or the Predator with rifled choke tubes? If so, what were the results?

We just got back one test, but it appears the chamber of the gun was 3 1/2", smoothbore with rifled tube......groups wer not at all good. At present I don't know if it was the longer chamber or that Terminator Slugs don't like rifled choke tubes.
As soon as I see enough tests to judge, I'll post.......James

As soon as my slugs show up, I'm going to shoot them with a rifled choke tube, and post the results.

ghost ring,fiber optic or red dot(I do consider those sisht basic).
Stock,the 870 Express deer gun comes with a monte-carlo stock,I think,is it to high?
Would a wood stock be better as it's a little bit heavier and I could but in a mercury recoil damper,do they work?
Mr. Gates and others also poste about ataching a rifled slug barrel to an 870 via epoxy,what about an Ithaca Deerslayer II?

Sir, I vote for the ghost ring sight. A red dot is pretty cool but they use batteries, which isn't "basic" enough for me. Fiber optics look a little fragile.

The monte carlo stock is to raise your eye to scope height. For irons, I'd get the straight stock.

Mercury dampers work. So does loading a couple of fired shells with lead shot (no powder) and affixing them firmly in the stock cavity (enlarged if need be). This is easier with a wood stock. It is also easier to cut off a wood stock if you like a short stock or want to add a really thick recoil pad.

The point of using solder or epoxy to affix the barrel to the action is to reduce play and increase accuracy. It will work on any pump gun, but won't work on autos like the Browning A5 because the barrel has to move to cycle the action.

The 870 is a great choice for several reasons, one of which is the availability of aftermarket parts to customize it. One useful add-on is a high capacity magazine. Now, I know you don't need 8 shots to kill a deer, but the longer magazine is attached to the barrel with a hanger and makes the barrel stiffer, thus improving accuracy. Some extra ammo out near the muzzle weights the barrel too, making the gun steadier on repeat shots and countering the butt-heavy effect of the lead shot and thick pad.

Anyway, that's what I think. Have a great season with whatever you decide to buy!

Tumbleweeds,thankyou sir,BASIC.

Friends All......Tumbleweeds has some very good thoughts! Remember.....keep it simple! As I have posted in another thread.....we send our Remington 20" slug barrels up to Mike Orlen to have the barrel threaded for Remington tubes. Polychoke II has come out with a vent Poly that goes into the choke threads. Tod at Polychoke II says recoil reduction runs 20% to 30%.....should help on quick folow up shots.....James