Greetings:

I am looking at purchasing a Lubricator/Sizer. I am looking at three

Lyman 450
RCBS Lube-sizer
Saeco Lube sizer.

I am leaning more towards the Saeco, as it looks like it is built extremely well, but I am not exactly sure if this will be my best bed.

I would need dies and top punches for
357 mag
44 mag
45-70 govt.
7mm
32 H&R Mag


Any help would be appreciated.

Justin Korpal
920-471-8008
shooters forum member K0RPL

I use the 450 Lyman. Mine is an older one with the bottom O-Ring. This has a tendency to leak lube.
The newer models do not have this problem.

The Lyman and RCBS interchange their top punches which can be a plus.
Both Lyman and RCBS have the ability to allow the top punch to "float" loosly in the ram. This can be an advantage.
The linkage on the Lyman and the RCBS are not as strong as the Saeco. If you are bumping bullet noses or reducing grooved bullets for paper patching you need to use caution or you will bend the linkage. This is not a factor in normal sizing operations.

The BEST sizer unit is the Star.

The Lee push through sizers are handy to experiment with. These can be opened up easily to custom sizes.

I have my 450 mounted on a box similar to shoe shine box. Lyman used to sell these, I made mine after the picture in their catalog. I lube and size bullets on the tile in front of the fireplace. My wife is not fond of the smell of Alox but she is "tolerant." What she likes least is my complaining about the sizer in winter. She much prefers the Lee push through dies and the light "clack" of the Lee hand press!

P.S We are big .32 H&R Mag. fans. What are you shooting?

The Lee and the Star are both push thru the bottom sizers and do not use or need a top punch. I changed over to the Lee some years ago from the star and use the tumble lube system and have had excellent results. Simple, inexpensive and easy.

Right now I'm doing 45 colt, 44 mag, 41 mag and 357 pistols I also cast for a 54 cal muzzle loader and will be adding 7mm and 308 cal rifle.

The tumble lube system is so easy though a little messy ( thats why they make rubber gloves). Just put your bullets in a cottege cheese or miricle whip container, drizzle on a little liquid alox and swirl them around til they are coated. Set them on a piece of wax paper to dry overnight.

Run them thru the sizer if needed. (most of my Lee molds can shoot dropped from the mold unless they need a gas check) If you have sized them I do a recoat with the alox.

I have not have any leading problems with this system.

The BEST sizer unit is the Star.The Star lubricator/sizer is a commercial quality tool built to last almost forever. It's also the fastest tool as each downstroke of the handle produces a sized and lubricated bullet which drops through the sizing die into a container. Some users have reported sizing close to 1000 bullets an hour. Star used to require separate bullet punches to match the various bullet nose configurations but they have recently changed over to pushing the bullets nose first through the sizing die. Now, one punch will fit the base of all bullets. Lubricant is force fed by a threaded feed shaft that has a very strong coil spring attached to it. Many bullets can be lubed with one setting of the feed shaft depending on the hardness of the lube. Parts and service for the Star is available from Magma Engineering which has a web site. The only obvious drawback to the Star is the initial cost. Used tools are selling for about $150 on ebay. Dies are selling for about $30. I am not trying to sell anyone a Star nor am I saying that other tools are not as good. I have a Star and am only offering my experiences with the tool. I am not a Star snob.

Good Evening:

I am going to try and answer all questions.

I think the lyman 450 that I was looking at was a earlier one, and the linkage just looked too Mickey Mouse to me, Like I said I didn't use it, I just looked at it. I also looked at the Saeco and it looks like it would stand up to Panzer Tank. I will have to look at the star offerings.

As far as the 32 H&R Mag goes, my girlfriends father got me into shooting contenders, and he had a 32 H&R Mag barrel.

I am going to be using the 32 H&R Mag barrel for Metallic silhouette. I also think it would be a good small game bullet. I am going to be using 90 Grain SWC Lee tumble lube bullets. After I get the lube sizer, I will then look for other molds designs. I have had nothing but good luck so far with casting, and all I have are LEE aluminum molds. I have a Production 10 pound bottom pour pot, and a Pro 4-20 pot.

I have tumble lubed all of my bullets as of this far, and while messy, it does work fine. Just gets to be a little messy if you cast 300-500, and then tumble all of them in a old cool whip container. It is probaly quicker then a lube/sizer, but with a lube sizer you don't need to clean off the noses of the bullets.


If anyone has anymore questions, please feel free to let me know.

I am going to be using the 32 H&R Mag barrel for Metallic silhouette. I also think it would be a good small game bullet. .

The Lyman 311008 will do the trick for both tasks. The TC barrels tend to have alarge throat. I shoot the 115 grain Lyman as cast either tumble lubed or hand lubed in our 24" Fox Ridge barrel.
Dont overlook the .308" dia. 110 grain JHP bullets for the .30 caliber rifles. These shoot well in the TC's and are not explosive at .32 mag. velocities.

I have two SAECO luberasizers and two lee sizers (had them first). They work great Dies for the RCBS/Lyman are less expensive so I envy those prices but the SAECO works great. Star is the "Best" IF YOU DO HIGH VOLUME. If not there is no advantage IMHO. To adjust the die for different bullets in the same cal you have to remove the Star die and fill the lube holes with lead shot to stop them. The SAECO can be adjusted for a one, two, 4 groove bullets etc. by adjusting the bottom stop. The SAECO has an arm that swings out to act as a stop so you can just swedge on a gas check without sizing the bullet. One last feature on the SAECO, the top punch has a taper cut which seats into the press Ram. The purpose is to square it to the center line. It can't be off by the clearance of the screwthread. Hope this helps. JB

JB is right about the Star being best for high volume bullet sizing but it manages to keep up pretty well with the others on low volume work too. I shoot handgun competition and average two to three boxes of ammo a week so the Star is a real time saver for me. The dies do have to be set up to match the bullet grooves. If you don't specify when you order a die, Star will send you a three groove (three rows of lube holes) die with a package of shot. You just put the shot in the unused lube holes and give it a tap with a punch. If you ever want to remove the shot, just drill them out. Star uses a universal top punch since it's purpose is to push on the base of the bullet rather than the nose. Saves you a little money there. I got my Star at an estate sale. Since it carried the same price as the two RCBS tools that were also on sale, I went with the Star. In retrospect, I should have bought all three. I am also a SAECO fan. Many of my bullets moulds are made by SAECO. They have a great reputation for turning out top quality products that never wear out. I like the features of the SAECO lubrisizer that JB mentioned and would definitly give it serious consideration. SAECO is sold on ebay too and a good place to shop but read the descriptions carefully and ask questions before you bid. I shop my SAECO bullet moulds there and so far, have been completely satisfied. Good luck on finding a lubrisizer!

Justin there is no doubt that the star is the caddy of the sizers. I have two Stars, an older Lyman 45, and a newer 450. I use the stars for pistol bullets, 357, 44, 41, and 32H&R and 32-20. The Lyman's are for rifle bullets mostly although sometimes I will put some 30 cal rifle in the Star because I do have a .310 die for it. The older Ly 45 is more precision then the 450 {less play in the ram] but the handle is prone to break if excessive force needs to be applied and Lyman no longer has the parts. The Star is a nose first sizer as is a Lee which is a good thing on rifle bullets because there is less chance of bending the nose or bumping it up in dia. If you plan on using that 32H&rR for sillywet the Rem 110 SN bulk bullets can be found for about $60 a thousand. Loaded with 10.5 gr of little gun powder is the most accurate load I have found in my 10in Contender. THIS IS ONLY A CONTENDER LOAD IT IS A HOTTER LOAD AND WOULD NOT BE SAFE IN A REVOLVER OR WEAKER ACTION. It is Wise to work up to it because there was a recall on one lot that was too fast.

Pb head

Justin there is no doubt that the star is the caddy of the sizers. I have two Stars, an older Lyman 45, and a newer 450. I use the stars for pistol bullets, 357, 44, 41, and 32H&R and 32-20. The Lyman's are for rifle bullets mostly although sometimes I will put some 30 cal rifle in the Star because I do have a .310 die for it. The older Ly 45 is more precision then the 450 {less play in the ram] but the handle is prone to break if excessive force needs to be applied and Lyman no longer has the parts. The Star is a nose first sizer as is a Lee which is a good thing on rifle bullets because there is less chance of bending the nose or bumping it up in dia. If you plan on using that 32H&rR for sillywet the Rem 110 SN bulk bullets can be found for about $60 a thousand. Loaded with 10.5 gr of little gun powder is the most accurate load I have found in my 10in Contender. THIS IS ONLY A CONTENDER LOAD IT IS A HOTTER LOAD AND WOULD NOT BE SAFE IN A REVOLVER OR WEAKER ACTION. It is Wise to work up to it because there was a recall on one lot that was too fast.

Pb head

The SAECO L/S is the only product that SAECO makes that I WOULD NOT recommend. The main gasket design is REALLY bad. Also it tears easily. They had a kit you can buy to fit it but the kit comes without instructions and actually has a part that you don't need. Worse yet that gasket inverts when it tears so if you only look at it after it has broken you see it in the machine backwards. I think that years ago they had a better design because older models don't have this problem BUT a new SAECO is, well, horrible. Sold mine and was glad to be rid of it.

The Star/Magma is nice. Takes a bit longer than most to change sizing dies but it is certainly fast.

The Lyman and RCBS are almost exact copies of each other. The RCBS, however, can handle a slightly larger diameter die easier as far as removing the die from the machine.

A few years ago Lyman changed the tolerances on both their sizing dies and their L/S. The result is that old dies may not fit into new machines.

An RCBS unit, of course, is guaranteed forever.

The Lyman and RCBS are almost exact copies of each other. The RCBS, however, can handle a slightly larger diameter die easier as far as removing the die from the machine..

I use a socket that I split to ease size die removal from the 450 Lyman I lower the stop and set the socket on top of it. With the retaining nut removed I lower the ram and the die comes right out of the sizer body.

Good Morning:

After much research and with the help of you guys, I have decided on going with the Magma Star lube sizer instead of the SAECO. My only question, is according to the Website, you need compressed air for the bullet lube feed. Is this true, or is that an option? Does it have a hand screw for manual operation? I really don't want to have to run air into the reloading room to lube bullets. I liked the Saeco, in that it looked to be built like a brick schmit house, but most of you guys said they had problems in the lube resivour department. Any help will be greatly appreciated.

Justin Korpal
920-471-8008

Justin, the compressed air set up is only a STAR option for high commercial output. The Star works fine off the hand screw mounted over the lube reservoir. No need to put a compressor in your loading room. You may find your best buy on ebay but be sure you are getting a tool in good condition. You can generally tell how well a tool has been maintained from the pictures and you can always email the sellers with questions. I have never reqretted going with the Star altho there are other fine tools on the market.

Marshal.

Thanks for the input. I am just going to order a new one from Magma Eng. Probaly Monday. I did not see a screw type feed on the picture on Magma's website, so that is why I wanted to ask. Do you by anychance have a digital camera that you can snap a picture of it for me? I would really appreciate.

Justin Korpal
920-471-8008

Justin, I don't have a digital (all my kids do) but you can see a Star L/S without the air unit on ebay.com. Select sporting goods and work your way to 'reloading', then search 'star'. It's a threaded shaft on the top of the unit with a handle tapped into the side. Enjoy your Star.

You can download a PDF of the original Star Instruction Manual at http://www.starreloaders.com/manuals/manuals.html#Downloads This includes a parts diagram which will give you a good idea of what the basic Star looks like (with out the air pressure attachment) You can also check out the Star Reloaders forum which includes a section on their Sizers. This forum doesn't get a lot of activiity, but there is some good information http://forum.starreloaders.com/

Thanks guys for all of the helpful info. I was working all weekend on my NRMA Reloading bench. i am real happy with the way it is turning out. Polyurethane is a pain in the butt.

Justin
920-471-8008

The Lee and the Star are both push thru the bottom sizers and do not use or need a top punch. I changed over to the Lee some years ago from the star and use the tumble lube system and have had excellent results. Simple, inexpensive and easy.

Right now I'm doing 45 colt, 44 mag, 41 mag and 357 pistols I also cast for a 54 cal muzzle loader and will be adding 7mm and 308 cal rifle.

The tumble lube system is so easy though a little messy ( thats why they make rubber gloves). Just put your bullets in a cottege cheese or miricle whip container, drizzle on a little liquid alox and swirl them around til they are coated. Set them on a piece of wax paper to dry overnight.

Run them thru the sizer if needed. (most of my Lee molds can shoot dropped from the mold unless they need a gas check) If you have sized them I do a recoat with the alox.

I have not have any leading problems with this system.


I use this same method...works equally well even with bullets without the tumble lube grooves. Im done messing with luber/sizers...the lee system is just plain easier and less time consuming. I run 250 grain keith 44 cal bullets up to 2000+ FPS out of my 444 and dont get any leading.

Greetings:

I too use the Lee liquid alox tumble lube method, and while a tad messy, works really well. So far, I have casted for 357 Mag/38 spec, 44 Mag/44 Special I have not tried it on conventional mold designs with lube grooves instead of the tumble lube grooves, but it appears that the Star Lube sizer will work out better for me, as I need to seat gas checks as well for my 7-30 Waters. All of the molds that I find for 7mm are gas checked.

Justin Korpal
920-471-8008