Recently bought a 25-06 used at a show. First Remmington I ever owned. Just got around to shooting it today, threw on on an old scope I had laying here, grabbed a box of Wally Worlds best?, and headed to the range. Burned through most of the box shooting 3 shoot groups, never got it sighted in but the second to last group was 3/4", the first ones and the last one were awful. Then I remembered why I had taken the scope off something else, the scopes guts were rattling around inside. QUESTION TO REMMINGTON SHOOTERS: When I disassembled the gun I noticed a small hump in the barrel channel near the tip of the forend, I expect this is to put pressure on the barrel. But the sling stud protrudes through the hump and contacts the barrel. Is this supposed to be so, or should I shorten the stud? COMMENT TO 3 SHOT GROUP LOVERS: Something inside this scope was so loose it rattled, making my groups purely a random event, it is statistically possible to get a small group by pure chance, (though not very often). Mathmatically, a five shot group would be significantly less likely. Please don't hijack this thread discussing 3 shot vs. 5 shot until I get my Remmington question answered. I just thought my experience was worth mentioning.

The barrel channel hump is normal on a 700. The long sling stud isn't, so feel free to shorten it.

Bye
Jack

thanks for the quick reply.

I don't own any Remingtons or rifles with pressure points as all my barrels are free-floated. However, if it was my rifle, I wouldn't want a swivel stud against the barrel. I would remedy that before I shot it again. The hump in the barrel channel is there purposefully, but many guys prefer to grind it down and float the barrel. Not all rifles respond positively to that treatment though. You should probably just take care of that stud, get a working scope put on it, and see if it shoots to your expectations. If not, then you can play with free-floating, bedding, etc.

You're right about 3 shot groups. A single one doesn't always mean a whole lot. But, if you shoot two or more 3 shot groups with a load, you get a much better picture of how accurate the load is. When developing loads or trying the same loads under different conditions, sometimes I like to lay one target over the other and hold it up to the light to see what the load is doing. Sometimes, it can tell you a lot. For my prairie dog loads, which must be accurate, I shoot 5 shot groups. It just helps to more quickly identify the more consistent loads.

amndouglas

Most of my rifles are Remingtons. Shorten the stud so it doesn't contact the barrel. Everything I've owned and shot with a barrel over 16 inches has benifitted by glassbedding/piller bedding or free floating.

On a new gun or a new used gun I always shoot it without doing any work on it to see what it will do. If your turning in wonderful groups don't do anything. Remember the old saying if it ain't broke don't fix it.

Best thing I can tell you is put a good piece of glass on it, that doesn't necessarily mean a really expensive glass. I've had pretty good luck with Simmons ATEC lately and I see Leapold is dropping the prices on some of their scopes.

I shoot one shot at a time til I have the gun shooting where I want it at a hundred yards, then three shot groups to finess the zero. After that five shot groups for a big game rifle and ten shot groups for a varmit rifle to give some idea what it will really do.

Just a followup, I just mounted a new Leupold scope, and checked with the boresighter. Assuming the recticles in the scope are relatively centered when new, there has to be something wrong with the base or rings. I adjusted the windage screws on the base successfully, but vertically the crosshairs are well below the field in the boresighter. I confirmed this at the range (I didn't adjust the scope at all, didn't want to adjust a brand new scope 20 or 30 clicks before I even started), it shoots something like 4" high at 40 yards (I was way over the target holder at 100 yards)...Since the mounts came used on the gun, I'm going to have the local gunsmith check the base to see if it's even the right one for a Remmington.

How large is the objective bell housing on your scope? Large (44mm, 50mm) lens require high mounting to clear the barrel.

The higher the scope center is from the bore center, the greater the need for vertical (elevation) adjustment. The "standard" scope body has a center about 1.25" above the center of the bore. "Standard" height rings can be used for such, as long as the objective lens is somewhere around 33mm to 40 mm for most rifles.

If the scope has to be mounted high above the bore, the rear mount may be shimmed to lower the scope reticle when shots are low. Shim the front when shots are high.

Burris makes a nifty set of rings with eccentric inserts that can accomodate elevation and windage problems.

The guy I bought if from said they were Leupold rings, they look a lot like the Redfield rings and base I have on another rifle. (the bases aren't marked and I've never used a Leupold base before) The rings measure the same height as my other medium Redfield rings. The scope is a 40 mm objective.

Again, assuming the scope came with the recticle centered, it just appears the base must be pointed downhill to the front, as much as 15 MOA or more. If the base screws are about 6 inches apart, and I did the math right, each 10 thousandths of shim under the front should lower the point of impact about 6 MOA. My guess is about 20 or 30 thousandths of shim should do.

Also, if you were wondering why I just don't crank the recticle up, I ruined a good (brand new)scope once by turning it too many turns adjusting with a bore-sighter, because of a poorly drilled and tapped mount. The scope manufacturer decided it was not a "material defect" and I had a high dollar paperweight.

Hmmmmmmm...........

Never heard of a properly constructed scope that would be ruined by adjusting to the maximum limits of the scope, unless you really torqued on the knobs.

Personally, I adjust the scope to the center of it's adjustment range, both windage and elevation, then use the rear ring (on one piece bases) to get the coarse windage somewhere near the boresighter crosshair, or actual eyeball boresight (deprimed case inserted into chamber and then find a target that can bee seen both through the primer hole and the scope). Ditto the shims for either the rear or front mounts. Then, actual range work will tweak in with scope adjustments to desired POI (Point of Impact) on the target.

Got an earful from the customer service rep at Redfield about adjusting the mounts first because excessive adjustment would screw the scope up. Now I try to get within a couple inches before I go to the range. Just never had one off this far vertically.

What do you use for shims, brass machine shims?

Mainly, cut up soda pop cans. Easy to cut with sissors or shears and thin enough to get fine tuning for elevation.

BTW - Redfield provided the absolute WORST repair service/customer service of any brand of scope I've ever owned.

One thing you want to watch for when shimming one of the scope bases is that your putting the scope out of alingment. You can get a set of scope rings so out of alignment that you can damage a scope when you tighten it down.

The scope ring actually is a clamp about one inch long. When you set these a few inches apart you have two clamps at different levels. Thats why they can bind and damage a scope if one is shimmed higher than the other.

I use a one inch reamer 12 inches long with a large cresent wrench to ream the rings so this won't happen. I've only had to do this a few times. I do use the reamer instead of the scope for ring and base installation. Using it like this without the reaming gives me dead on base and ring installation.

If these rings and bases are this much out of alignment I would consider getting a different set. The cost is nothing compared to messing up a scope.

If you go to brownells web site you can find scope base shims for this purpose. They are made to fit the bases. The tin can cut to fit do the same thing and you can make them black with a permenant marker.

I'd try some Weaver bases and some Weaver 4 X 4 rings. I've gone to them exclusively. They are easier to install a scope on than the "old" style Weavers and probably tuffer than any thing else out there. As Dad would say "They're as good as the best and better than the rest"

Snap On quality at Craftsman price. :D

I've got a one piece Redfield base on my triple duece that came on the gun when I bought it. When the barrel starts to get hot the point of impact starts to go up. The barrel is floated and if I wait for 2-3 minutes between shots it doesn't noticably affect p.o.i. I think I'm gonna get some 4 X 4's and put on it too.

faucettb What kind of scope mounts/bases do you use?

The suggestion to try another type ring and base, such as the Weaver, is a good one. But, you should also be able to see for yourself if their is a vertical misalignment in the current set of scope bases and rings.
My experience, limited to a few rifles, has been that factory screws are pretty close to being done right. The fault could be in the bases and rings that you have.
Since Remington 700 has no diameter difference between the front and rear of the receiver, the bases should be identical in height. By the same token, the lower half of the rings should be identical in height. If not, you have a mismatched set of bases, or rings.
You can, perhaps, see this by visual inspection. If not, take the top half of the rings off and see how the scope sits on the bottom half of the rings. The scope should lie perfectly flat. You could also take the scope off and lay a ruler in the bases to see if they are even.
Lastly, be careful about shimming, as that means the scope could be bent as you mount it, as already mentioned. You should only be shimming if there is a height difference to be made up.

Am anticipating the scope is mounted in a one-piece base, which will not torque a scope by shims under one end or the other. Two-piece bases DO require the rings be lapped to assure no offset between the ring centerlines.

I'd try some Weaver bases and some Weaver 4 X 4 rings. I've gone to them exclusively. They are easier to install a scope on than the "old" style Weavers and probably tuffer than any thing else out there. As Dad would say "They're as good as the best and better than the rest"

Snap On quality at Craftsman price. :D

I've got a one piece Redfield base on my triple duece that came on the gun when I bought it. When the barrel starts to get hot the point of impact starts to go up. The barrel is floated and if I wait for 2-3 minutes between shots it doesn't noticably affect p.o.i. I think I'm gonna get some 4 X 4's and put on it too.

faucettb What kind of scope mounts/bases do you use?

Mostly Leapold, but on my 308 model seven it came with Weaver. I've got Millet on a SRH and factory Ruger on a #1. All are two piece bases. On one 8mm mag I have the Leapold dual dovetail on two piece bases, on the other just a standard set. I was worried about the recoil, but really think the standard bases seem to work ok.

I havn't used one piece bases for so long I can't remember. They are ok to shim as they change the whole angle of the base. The two piece bases need reamed if you shim them. Sorry guys

Thanks guys. The base is one piece, so I think I can shim it w/o screwing up a scope. If that doesn't work I'll get a new set. The rings measure the same height with a calipers.

A guy at work said he thought they could be "long range" mounts, never heard of them. These would definitely be for long range. Any ideas what he is talking about?

The mount has a forward slope so you don't run out of adjustment in your scope at very long range, say 1000 yards. Here's an almost local example.
http://www.nearmfg.com/

Bye
Jack

Thanks all,

Problem solved (at least identified), the caliper says the base is definitely sloped down to the front. Why I didn't check that before I don't know. Must be a "long range" base.