Hi all, long time lurker first time poster.

I am an avid shooter and handloader. I purchased my first revolver, a used Ruger Blackhawk chambered in .45LC, about a year and a half ago. I went with Ruger because they have a great reputation, especially among reloaders. I began handloading starting with light loads and working up, always checking for signs of excess pressure. The load I was shooting yesterday when the gun blew apart was 20gr of Hogden H110 behind a 300gr lead gas checked bullet. I had shot this load many times prior to this incident and was very certain that it is a safe load. In addition I had just finished fitting and installing brand new custom grips. In that process I had examined the grip frame thoroughly and did not notice anything unusual. I went to the range with the aforementioned load and the new grips installed, loaded the pistol and proceeded to shoot. On the sixth round the frame of the revolver tore away from the grip frame and went spiraling 12 feet or so into the air before land 4 feet in front of me. I was still holding the grips and a piece of the grip frame in my hand. Has anyone ever heard of an aluminum grip frame failing? If so, in what make and caliber? Thanks for the help and sorry for looong post.

Ray

EDIT: I should note this gun was manufactured in 1994.

I'll sure be interested in the responses you get on this unusual problem. I have a number of the old three screw Blackhawks in .44 mag, one of which I had converted to a five shot .45LC that I use for loads exceeding your problem load and have not had a problem with the aluminum frame.

Dan

Hello atd6960 welcome to the forum. I have read your post several times.IMHO I think something else might have went wrong. If the frame landed 4 feet in front of you after you fired it I tend to believe something else happened to cause the grip frame to come apart as you mentioned. Just speculating mind you but maybe wrong powder charge, barrel obstruction, cylinder out of time or something. You would think that with the recoil it would have went behind you. I have never heard of this type of thing before. That is a good one to analyze tho.One of my rugers has about 15 years on it and never a problem.

How's the rest of the gun look? If the steel parts are not damaged, I'd chalk it up to a bad or weak aluminum casting.

That's not really a horribly excessive load.... shouldn't be over pressure.

Scrounge up a steel grip frame, either from a Bisley or Vaquero, and you are back in business, if the rest of the gun is OK. As a plus, the extra weight of the steel will make the recoil more tolerable.

I've quit shooting hot loads through my aluminum-framed .45 Colt; not because I had problems, but because it just wasn't any fun.

The steel looks ok externally... I'm no gunsmith though and I will have it checked thoroughly before I shoot it again. I have been showing the firearm to several people and the consensus is a weak casting. Especially since it fired so well for so many rounds. I would be upset though if I wasnt able to put the hotter loads thru my gun anymore... thats what I bought it for. The frame went spiraling into the air, and to be honest, it scared the **** out of me. It may have landed much closer than 4 feet, I honestly was in shock a bit so my memory isn't 100%.

I'm glad your O.K. Take a good look at the screws that hold it all together. That is the only "weak link" that I can imagine.
Cheezywan

It is possible to over tighten the screws...or that some of the scrwes were loose shifting all the load onto one or two tight ones.Would be interrested is seeing that grip frame in order to see where it failed.

IF the cylinder/frame/barrel all check out as undamaged, then I'd have to go with either a fault in the grip frame (which could have been there from the start and just decided it had enough and let go) or sometime in the past taht grip frame got laterally stressed.

Woulda scared the fluff outta me too and I'm fearless!! Seems like there was a thread about trying to make a 45LC into something it shouldn't. I think we found our answer!!

http://www.shootersforum.com/showthred.htm?t=22530

Do you regularly check the grip frame screws? One of my Bisleys had a habit of shaking the grip frame screws loose after a lengthly session with 44 mag, and above, level loads. Corrected it with Marshalls tip of using fingernail polish on the threads. Are the screws still in the gun or did they shear?

Do you regularly check the grip frame screws? One of my Bisleys had a habit of shaking the grip frame screws loose after a lengthly session with 44 mag, and above, level loads. Corrected it with Marshalls tip of using fingernail polish on the threads. Are the screws still in the gun or did they shear?

Reminds me...just in case anyone out there has my old Ruger Blackhawk .41mag. with a scope mount that just won't come off.

Once had a scoped revovler shear it's screws (just broke them dead even with the top strap, leaving the threaded parts still in the holes)...scope and mount sailed up..dinked off the rising barrel (leaving a nice scratch)...bounced back and boinked me right between the eyes.



Mount could be re-used...which it was after (1) removing the threaded sections, drilling out the mount's holes, and retapping the frame to the next size up (2) polishing off the blue on the bottom of the mount and the top of the frame (3) TINNING the bottom or the mount and the top of the revolver frame with low temp. silver solder, screwing it down, then heating it until the solder melted and sucking in the screws taking in all the slack.

Then proceeeded to kill the scope...lasted a good while, but at one shot, the gun came down out of recoil with "bug eyes" (that kind of multi-facet look of a fly's eye).

(Don't ask about the load...was "back in the day" and the load being used is so far above today's max that it's a wonder I still have all my fingers.)

WHy? Rock hard temepered screws tightened down too far is my best guess...better the screws bend a bit, not just snap in 1/2 when over stressed.

Do you regularly check the grip frame screws? One of my Bisleys had a habit of shaking the grip frame screws loose after a lengthly session with 44 mag, and above, level loads. Corrected it with Marshalls tip of using fingernail polish on the threads. Are the screws still in the gun or did they shear?


I do check the screws when I clean the gun which is probably about once every 100 or so rounds. I did tighten them last time as they were loose, but I did not crank them down especially hard. I really just seated them flush. The grip frame actually tore away right above the top of my palm, leaving all the grip frame screws and some of the grip frame still fastened to the steel frame of the revolver. Thus leaving me with a jagged chunk of metal in my hand.

Probably a flawed gripframe casting to begin with. Send the pieces back to Ruger with a letter explaining what happened. They may send you a new gripframe and hopefully the replacement will be made of steel. Glad to hear you weren't injured.

Probably a flawed gripframe casting to begin with. Send the pieces back to Ruger with a letter explaining what happened. They may send you a new gripframe and hopefully the replacement will be made of steel. Glad to hear you weren't injured.

I talked to a Ruger rep earlier and they were very helpful. Like you said they asked for a letter explaining the situation and for the pieces to be shipped back. I shipped the gun... or what is left of it back to Ruger. Hopefully they will be able to tell me what went wrong and why. I am also going to see if they will replace my underwear which were damaged in the incident. Thanks for the comments guys.

Ray

I talked to a Ruger rep earlier and they were very helpful. Like you said they asked for a letter explaining the situation and for the pieces to be shipped back. I shipped the gun... or what is left of it back to Ruger. Hopefully they will be able to tell me what went wrong and why. I am also going to see if they will replace my underwear which were damaged in the incident. Thanks for the comments guys.

Ray

Ray

I ran a small gunsmith shop for a lot of years and never saw a Ruger come apart like that. I suggest you tell Ruger you want a new gun to replace that one. Wouldn't doubt they send you one. There are some real liabililty issues here.

Let me understand this ! The frame ,cylinder and barrel are OK but just the grip frame either split or let go , or the grip frame screws failed ? JAGG

Let me understand this ! The frame ,cylinder and barrel are OK but just the grip frame either split or let go , or the grip frame screws failed ? JAGG

A chunk of the aluminum grip frame along with all of the grip frame screws are still attached to the steel frame of the revolver (the piece that flew into the air). I was left holding the wood grips and a ragged chunk of cast aluminum.

I would send the grip frame back to Ruger ! They might want to have a recall after checking this frame over ! Or they might send you a new one free ! I have heard of the old Super vel ammo blowing off the whole section infront of the grip apart on a S&W Cheif Special years back ! But that was a one piece SS frame ! JAGG

UPDATE:

I got a call back from Ruger today. They said they would replace the grip frame for free and gave me a choice of aluminum or steel(I chose steel this time). They at first said they would be unable to compensate me for the brand new $75 grips that were damaged in the incident. I told them that I was upset, so they had me fax my receipt over to them. They said they would have a supervisor look at it and get back to me. They are not going to refund the $45 shipping cost that I paid to get the gun to them. Depending on what kind of compensation they offer for the grips will determine whether I buy another Ruger. I was thinking of having the gun rebarreled anyway so if they do that for free or at a discount I will be pretty happy. If anyone has an ideas or comments please shoot em my way. BTW the grips that were damaged can be found here

http://www.pistolgrips.com/blackhawkvaquero.html

Ruger Blackhawk/Vaquero OSFG
Walnut
$70.00

Thanks,
Ray

Oh yeah I got these pics from my uncle's camera. now you can see what I mean.

Oh yeah I got these pics from my uncle's camera. now you can see what I mean.
I can't see it quite as well as I would like to. What I can see is that you have just survived a lightning strike. If I were in customer service you would get grips and a coupon for new undies of your choice. A very rare failure.

I think I see the problem. You can get a pretty good grip on the revolver, with those stocks. Let me guess, did they really cut down on muzzle rise, vs. the standard factory stocks?

Think that the aftermarket stocks were letting your hands get more leverage on the gun, and putting more stress on the grip frame.

Dug out a Blackhawk and took a hard look at the grip frame and those posted pictures...and am wondering about how those custom grips were fitted.

Not saying that's the cause...but if some compression were put on the grip frame when reattaching it, that bottom break is just where I'd expect it to be....once the bottom broke loose, the pivoting motion of the gun would put the stress on the top attchment. Noticed the top break is not on a shear line that firing would have produced, more like the gun pivoted after the bottom section let go.

Just suspisious of the only thing that was changed before the break; may have been a fault in the frame that let go, but suspect the new grips had somthing to do with putting stress on that fault.

Could be that the new grips had nothing to do with it...that that fault line just descided to let go at that moment...but that would require two unusual events rather than just one, so supect the two are somehow related.

Could be as the last poster stated, the increase leverge of the longer grip finally over stressed the fault.

Boy are those pictures scary.....my firend, you've only got eight of 'em left.

Dan

I had similiar over sized finger groove grips on the gun before I put these new ones on. I liked the lighter color of the walnut so I swapped the rosewood OSFG to my .357 and put those new ones on the .45lc. I have big hands and I get a much better grip and am much more accurate with the oversized grips. Thanks again for the responses.

Ray

Maybe this is why the Bisley has a steel grip frame. The Bisley accomplishes the same thing that these grips do, more or less, through grip frame shape. If the added leverage was a factor. Of the three non-Bisleys I have, two have steel grip frames, those pictures make me happy that's the case.

Hey guys, Sorry to resurrect this thread but I wanted to post an update. Ruger repaired the grip grame as well as the trigger and several other parts for free. They also gave me a very sharp looking stock frame and reimbursed me for the custom grips that were ruined. They did not say definitively that this was a manufacturing error nor did they say it was a user error but they did fix it for free so draw your own conclusions on that. I also had the barrel replaced and the whole gun is reblued. The cost to me on that was about 100 bucks. I took the gun out last weekend and fired a few of my pet loads through it and was able to hit a 6" steel plate from 50 yards nearly every time. (shooting open sites from a rest.) Overal I have to say I was very pleased with Ruger's customer service.

Thanks again for all the comments and input.

Ray

Happy for you that Ruger did the right thing. :)

This is the first time I have been at this forum, and have to add my two cents worth to the discussion.
I agree with Marshall, and some of the others, as I am a member of the American Gunsmith ***. and have been for the past 20 years. I don't beleive I have ever heard of a Blackhawk ever doing what you say happened. The only thing I can think of is that the screws were lose, or were wabbled out in the alluminum frame. I also agree with the others, send it back to Ruger, as they are great at takeing care of their guns.. I sent one back a few years ago because someone had broken the screws off inside the frame, and then, glued the remainder of the screws in to hold it together long enough to sell it.. If I had used full house 357 loads it, it could have been a bad situation. Being a gunnut that I am, I first took the gun apart and inspected it before I shot it. Ruger repaired it and replaced all the screws that were buggered up and sent it back to me at no charge. Good luck and hope you don't have any further experiences like that again. Hi all, long time lurker first time poster.

I am an avid shooter and handloader. I purchased my first revolver, a used Ruger Blackhawk chambered in .45LC, about a year and a half ago. I went with Ruger because they have a great reputation, especially among reloaders. I began handloading starting with light loads and working up, always checking for signs of excess pressure. The load I was shooting yesterday when the gun blew apart was 20gr of Hogden H110 behind a 300gr lead gas checked bullet. I had shot this load many times prior to this incident and was very certain that it is a safe load. In addition I had just finished fitting and installing brand new custom grips. In that process I had examined the grip frame thoroughly and did not notice anything unusual. I went to the range with the aforementioned load and the new grips installed, loaded the pistol and proceeded to shoot. On the sixth round the frame of the revolver tore away from the grip frame and went spiraling 12 feet or so into the air before land 4 feet in front of me. I was still holding the grips and a piece of the grip frame in my hand. Has anyone ever heard of an aluminum grip frame failing? If so, in what make and caliber? Thanks for the help and sorry for looong post.

Ray

EDIT: I should note this gun was manufactured in 1994.

oldlawman502, the guy sent the pistol back to Ruger last year. Read the post two above yours. :cool:

Ray, good to hear how well that "new" gun shoots. Don't know how in the heck you shot it that well?! Me, after having a gun blow apart in my hands, would be flinching soooooo bad!

Jim

Good to hear that Ruger took care of you well.

Hey guys, Sorry to resurrect this thread but I wanted to post an update. Ruger repaired the grip grame as well as the trigger and several other parts for free. They also gave me a very sharp looking stock frame and reimbursed me for the custom grips that were ruined. They did not say definitively that this was a manufacturing error nor did they say it was a user error but they did fix it for free so draw your own conclusions on that. I also had the barrel replaced and the whole gun is reblued. The cost to me on that was about 100 bucks. I took the gun out last weekend and fired a few of my pet loads through it and was able to hit a 6" steel plate from 50 yards nearly every time. (shooting open sites from a rest.) Overal I have to say I was very pleased with Ruger's customer service.

Thanks again for all the comments and input.

Ray
They did not say definitively that this was a manufacturing error nor did they say it was a user error but they did fix it for free so draw your own conclusions on that.

Just a quick FYI - When I started reloading, I seated a lead bullet way to deep in a 44 magnum over a start load of universal- I shot several of its mates through my blackhawk, and decided, what the heck, shouldn't be a problem! Big Problem! over pressure, bulged the cylinder wall, cylinder wouldn't rotate anymore. Went to the local sporting goods/gunsmith shop, feeling very stupid. They said, Ruger is great, write up what happened, we'll ship it in.

Ruger, with my letter in their hands saying I was an idiot and fully responsible, replaced the cylinder and shipped the gun back to the store for no charge. The store owner dinged me $15 for shipping and his time. Now, the only down side is that the gun won't group like it used to, but I think I have found the solution in the TECH TIPS on this great site, and will be polishing the chambers of the new cylinder. Thanks Mr. Stanton!!