Hello

I'm new to the forum and need some advice - I just got back in to shooting.

I would like to get a new deer rifle that I can also shoot at the range.

But - can't decide between the Savage Hunter 11G or Winchester Model 70 Featherweight - the savage is about $200 cheaper but $$ is not the 1st. issue

I'm a short guy 5'6' with small hands and after holding each at Grainger Mnt. I like the thinness of the Model 70 over the thicker feel if the Savage.

The Model 70 justs feel better on my shoulder - but I like Savage I think their a great Co. and I know they make excelent rifles.

Does the accu trigger have significant advantage over Winchester trigger??

When asked for advice - several people have questioned the accuracy of the winchester rifles being produced as of late. I was told Winchester is for sale but has found no takers due to worn out tooling. This worn out tooling is being blamed for produceing inaccurate rifles - ? is this true ?

Thanks in advance for your advice

chris,
I haven't heard any rumors to the effect that you've heard, either the accuracy issue, or that Winchester's up for sale. A company being up for sale, however, can mean a lot of things and could possibly not have any link to financial troubles. Curious, what was the source of those rumors?

I've read great reviews about the accu-trigger but I have no experience with them. The Win Mod 70 trigger is the standard that all others are measured by due to it's simple construction and ease of adjustability.

I can't knock the Savage due to unfamiliarity, but I personally favor the Winchester Mod 70 just from years of experience with their rifles from pre-'64 to todays crop. Personal preference is like opinion....everyone has one! Is a $200 difference worth the better feel?

Chris,
Could be your source may have Winchester mixed up with Remington. We have seen a couple of reports about Remington's financial troubles in the past month or two. I haven't heard of accuracy issues with the M70 either.

If I were buying a new rifle tomorrow, I'd probably go with the M70, but that is just me. Like you, they do fit me better and I believe if it fits you, you will shoot it better and hunt more effectively with it.

My hunting buddy just bought a Savage in 7mm Rem mag with the accu trigger. It's an excellent trigger on a factory rifle in the money class the Savage is.

Winchester triggers have always been adjustable along with Remington triggers. I helped sight in his new Savage and was impressed by the accutrigger and I usually take some impressing.

It's kinda a two stage affair and can be adjusted down pretty low for a deer rifle, but after a lot of years of shooting I still like the Remington and Winchester single stage triggers adjusted properly.

The best I can tell you is my buddy got his rifle sighted in and I ask him to try my Remington 700 Mountian rifle. He had just put about 20 rounds thru his new savage after I had adjusted the trigger. When he shot my Remington all he could say was "oh my".

A properly adjusted Remington or Winchester is a joy to shoot and the trigger can be super. I used to use Canjur single set triggers in all my varmit rifles and these are even better.

Best I can say is buy the rifle that fits you best and have a competent gunsmith work over and adjust the trigger or have a really good aftermarket trigger installed. An excellent trigger is the best thing you can do for your shooting accuracy. If you buy a Ruger 77 an aftermarket adjustable trigger is almost a must.

I have not heard of the rumors you mention either. I have both Savage and Winchester rifles, and like them both...but I'll take a M70 100% of the time if it's going to have a wood handle on it. I don't really see how you can go wrong in any way with a M70 Featherweight. The Accutrigger is a true innovation, very impressive, but a the M70's adjustable trigger is pretty much all most guys could ask for. If it was to be a varmint rifle, or a long range target rifle, I'd probably take the Savage over the M70 and not have to think very hard about it. Hunting rifle would be the M70 without question.

chris:

I would suggest that you also check out Brownings Micro-Hunter rifle. It has a stock with a slightly shorter length of pull that you might like.

I have one in 243 Win that will never leave my possession.

I suggest you go with the one that feels better. Triggers and other metal can be tweaked by a gunsmith, but changing the "feel" and balance is nearly impossible

Jaywalker

[QUOTE=alyeska338]Chris,
Could be your source may have Winchester mixed up with Remington. We have seen a couple of reports about Remington's financial troubles in the past month or two. I haven't heard of accuracy issues with the M70 either.

That sounds right. Winchester and Browning are run by the same company now. Winchester/Browning has had a lot of success with their WSM and WSSM series while Remington's own short mag offerings have lagged. (Kind of like the 6mm Rem vs .243 all over again.) Remington needs the CDL to take off. In any case. their shotgun sales should keep them going I suspect.

Winchester got into the same trap as Remington a few years back trying to produce arms cheaply for Wal-mart. They produce some cheaper rifles with push feed bolts rather than the true pre-64 style controlled round action. (In other words -they are not REALLY Model 70s). If you stay with the true Model 70s (Classic Featherweight, Classic WMS, Classic Safari) you will be happy. These run from between $750 for the classic featherweight to $1200 for the safari.

You said money was not an issue, but if it was, I would look for a used Classic Featherwieght in .30-06 or .270 if I needed a good hunting rifle. So many guys are jumping on this short mag craze, you might be able to find some good .270/06s that have been traded in. I found my Model 70 -06 barely used several years ago. It shoots 3/4" groups and was $250 cheaper than a new one. Can't ask for more.

See this sight: http://www.winchesterguns.com/prodinfo/catalog/category.asp?cat=001C

As for Savage, they are good solid rifles that shoot good out of the box. The Browning A-bolt and Weatherby Vangard are good options also. I like Ruger 77s, but not their trigger. Aftermarket triggers are not too expensive though. The Rugers are very well built rifles.

Are all model 70 at wal-mart different the those from other stores?

They are slightly different, but not lower quality...

Whatever you buy, make sure its made in the USA... you can't go wrong.

Are all model 70 at wal-mart different the those from other stores?

I looked at one today. A .270 with carbon stock. It had a push feed bolt. It did have the classic 3 pos safety. But to me, it is just not a Model 70 without that old standard modified mauser controlled action. It's probably a fine rifle, but I wish Winchester would have dubbed it a Model 80 or whatever!

chris:

I would suggest that you also check out Brownings Micro-Hunter rifle. It has a stock with a slightly shorter length of pull that you might like.

I have one in 243 Win that will never leave my possession.

I was going to suggest this as well and there is also the Win M70 Compact and Rem M7. My youngest brother is about 5'5" and he has the Browning Micro Hunter in 308 Win and it fits him great and he loves it. I think they are specifially designed for young and smaller in stature shooters.

Bird Dog is right, a bolt is just not the same w/o the controlled feed. I have an M70 Westerner version w/ push feed in 30-06 and it will sometimes jam the first round on a full magazine and if you miss feed and try to pull the bolt to eject the buggered round, if it doesn't catch the extractor, you have to drop the rifle and manually remove it.

As for M-70 accuracy, mine is super but I have seen others that would not hit for nothing but these are rare cases (only two or three in the last 25 years or so) and everyone I know of has been repaired/replaced by Win. without incident.

Older Savage rifles, all action types, were very good but I have no experience with the newer ones. I'm a little suspect of the new Savage over their destruction of company records from the old Savage?..?

As for USA made only, horse pucky! There are some really good rifles out there made in other countries than ours and to discount them simply because of their origin is depriving yourself for no good reason.

If I was to buy another bolt rifle, I'd probably look at Weatherby & CZ first.

You might want to look at the Ruger compact M77. It may fit you the best. It will need trigger work but I think its worth it. The scout model is probably the best of the bunch.