I recently came to a conclusion, larger bullet holes are better. Last weekend, I helped blood trail two deer. One deer was shot with a 243 and the other was shot with a 30-06. Both shots were good hits just behind the front shoulder and exiting just behind the front shoulder on the other side of the deer. Both deer ran into the same thicket and traveled between 100 and 150 yards through brush, vines, and staplings.

The 243 blood trail was very hard to follow and took about 4 hours. We had to get down very close to the ground to look for very small drops or spects of blood and we had to examine the leaves on bushes for smirted blood.

The 30-06 blood trail was much easier to follow. There was just more blood making it to the outside of the deer. We could walk along and see blood on leaves, grass, or smirded on vines. It took us about 15 minutes to work our way through the brush, briars, and vines to find the deer.

I really like my BLR 308, but this weekend, I am taking my 444 just because it makes a bigger hole.

I recently came to a conclusion, larger bullet holes are better. Last weekend, I helped blood trail two deer. One deer was shot with a 243 and the other was shot with a 30-06. Both shots were good hits just behind the front shoulder and exiting just behind the front shoulder on the other side of the deer. Both deer ran into the same thicket and traveled between 100 and 150 yards through brush, vines, and staplings.

The 243 blood trail was very hard to follow and took about 4 hours. We had to get down very close to the ground to look for very small drops or spects of blood and we had to examine the leaves on bushes for smirted blood.

The 30-06 blood trail was much easier to follow. There was just more blood making it to the outside of the deer. We could walk along and see blood on leaves, grass, or smirded on vines. It took us about 15 minutes to work our way through the brush, briars, and vines to find the deer.

I really like my BLR 308, but this weekend, I am taking my 444 just because it makes a bigger hole.

I made the mistake of missing my first shot this past weekend, and ended up putting the second shot into the rear quarter (not sure where, right side hip, I think) of the escaping deer. Knocked him down, got back up with blood on him. Ran into a ravine full of brush. Plenty of blood (pools, rubs, drips) to follow for 2-300 yards. Then, it went down to just drips. Then seems to stop all together.

Hit him with a .270, and he bled fine....for a little while. I'd guess the right shot with almost any caliber will make a deer bleed just fine. It's a matter of hitting him such that he can't leave a trail! :)

jonas

Taylor, .308 is the same caliber as 30.06!, Different case. I do agree with your logic. I use a 7mm Rem. mag. or .303 to .32 cal. for deer. They don't go far! Your Marlin will take it to the extreme at close range. Best of luck! JP

It all depends upon the vageries of where an animal is hit, the type and performance of the bullet and so on. There are no hard and fast rules, but bigger bullets do seem to perform better.

I've seen deer shot at close range with some of the 7mm and 30 cal magnums that went a long ways. Bullet didn't open up well and penciled thru.

Sometimes there's just no explanation. I shoot a Rem 8mm mag, Seirra 220 grain bullet at a little over 3000 fps and usually deer just elevator to the ground with a good hit. Elk on the other hand are much tougher. Moose and black bear both seem on par with deer.

Three years ago I shot a nice whitetail buck (21 inch basket) at about 100 yards or so. I was shooting uphill and offhand and instead of a heart lung shot got a high lung shot about four inches below the spine.

Deer took off like a rabbit and ran 150 to 200 yards uphill into a brushy, blowdown steep draw. I was sure of the shot so my buddy and I sat down and waited for a while then started tracking.

That deer was blowing blood out of both sides of it's lungs and left an excellent blood trail. It was slamming trees from one side to the other. We walked by it before we saw it. When I opened it's lungs they were totally jellyied. It must have a been a tough old buck to go that far.

Only thing I can tell you from my experience is when shot, unless you've short circuited the brain, broken the spinal cord or broken something that will not allow an animal to run they can and will do the darndest things.

Anyway though I've seen some fantastic kills with the 243 and other small bores I do have to agree that bigger seems to kill better.

In the thick cover of Upstate NY, I tend to use one of my big bore leveractions. Have not had to chase anything more than 50 yards from point of impact. Big slow and ugly works well for my type of hunting.

Yeah, be careful putting your .308 away, you may have more work! My partner just dropped one that had to be trailed, witha .45-70 at 125 yards, and the bullet was under the far shoulder skin when we butchered! No exit. Such a huge bullet, but expended all it's energy inside. My .308 on the other hand, shooting 165 SST's has never failed to exit with pretty explosive holes. Ahem, the four deer shot with it did not take one step either....tho' the last one managed to switch directions before hitting the ground. Now the search for a new bullet again. . . :D

Another partner shoots a 6mm and brags that it rarely exits, dropping his deer where he can see him. But one day....one will run away and how will we find it?

Has anyone noticed when the tempature is up small holes will bleed freely, when its around freezeing or below it takes a larger hole to keep the fat in the blood from sealing the holes. In real cold weather I use 44mag rifle, big hole in big hole out. Or 30-06 nosler ballistic tip Dime size hole in ,Two in. hole out.

Taylor, .308 is the same caliber as 30.06!, Different case. I do agree with your logic. I use a 7mm Rem. mag. or .303 to .32 cal. for deer. They don't go far! Your Marlin will take it to the extreme at close range. Best of luck! JP
I agree with the .303.
We use .303s on alot of things here in Oz and the consensus is that, while they may not be as whizz bang or high velocity as more modern rounds, what ever gets hit by a .303 STAYS hit! :D
Woodleigh at present is making a 215gn RNSN which has proved very accurate and I intend to try it out when a Canadian friend acquires me a nice sportered Ross rifle. ;)

My buddy hit a deer with a Silverado-1500HD.

...The blood trail was not hard to follow at all :) .

i've shot deer with 243win most have dropped in there tracks.My friend son shot a moose with a 243[ Would never recomend a 243 for moose) and dropped himin his tracks.My friend shot a moose 3 times with a 300 win and we had to track it.What this all mean?.......shot placement with a quality bulletdoes the job and know your critter vitals

Wow,

I hate to chime in here with so many replies already so well spoken. There are two schools of thought here and we already know the outcome however, for the sake of some will be brief and explain.

Small and fast verses big and slow, foot lbs of energy verses larger hole. Internal trauma and bullet resting on the far skin, verses complete penetration and exit wounds.

I have a friend, his name is Mike. Mike has a custom 7mm stw and all the trimmings. Mike uses the smallest, fastest, flattest shooting round that money can afford him to buy from his reloading partner. He has lost more than a half dozen deer over the last two years, some shot more than once with that extraordinarily big gun. Why? Because ft lbs don't kill animals, trauma and vital damage does. One of the deer he did kill, when we field dressed it, had most of the lungs and heart in tact and, only a small hole in a heart artery actually killed the animal, the bullet disintegrated on entry and "powdered" most of the internal organs. Using a nosler ballistic tip going that fast spinning as fast as it is, the bullet would sometimes come apart and send a dust puff at the range somewhere about 30 yards out. The fouled bore will sometimes cause it to come apart. It is a great gun but there again, lbs don't kill an animal.

I have another friend who has only lost three animals in his whole hunting career(more than 30 years). He uses a .308 in a nice remington and practices quite a bit. He also uses Barnes X ammo which I handload for him, and before that he used nosler partitions and before that rem core lock and even before that hornady soft points. The game always have an entrance and exit wound, they usually run between 5 and 25 yards and collapse. Two different people with entirely different ideas of how to prepare for the hunt. The military designed the 45-70 to shoot through a 6 inch timber at a half mile and, it does that real well. It will also break a deer's back and put him/her down to stay.

The thing is that you're not seeing the problem for what it is. The problem is the bullet is not doing it's job for the smaller caliber and the larger one is. If the smaller one was say a barnes x or lapua naturalis or even a nosler partition or swift a frame, they would stay together and make a blood channel through and through the animal, killing it humanely with even the .243 win. Have dropped elk with the .243 with imr 4350 and a 95 grain x bullet without any problem at all. They run about 25 yards and fold up like a briefcase. The bigger one is working because there is enough mass on it to stay together, keep the momentum and penetrate the animal completely. Change bullets or ammo, pmc makes some with barnes x in them if you don't reload and then see what happens. It will make a believer out of you. Lapua also makes a very similar bullet in there ammunition called naturalis.

Trauma and a good blood channel kill animals humanely and cleanly, not ft lbs. And, you can't track ft lbs through the grass and briars and pine needles after a shot either. If you change your bullet selection Taylor, I believe you will be fine. You sound like a real concerned hunter wanting to be humane and that is great. I admire you for that and hope have helped in some small way. Happy Hunting!!!

SHOOT WELL.
LOAD BETTER.

After seeing first hand the kind of blood trail a big bore leaves verses the .270s/30-06s/308s/7mgs that me and my friends used to use I am forever sold on the big hole in, bigger hole out way of thinking. I put down a buck this year with a bearthooth 405gr out of my 45/70 and I swear I have never seen an animal that appeared to be hit so hard. The blood trail looked like it had been made by a drunk with a 5gal bucket of blood.
However this does limit you to shorter range hunting which is fine with me, I seldom hunt anywhere where shots over 200yds are required anyway. But if a longer shooting stick is required I'm a big fan of the 308 shooting 165s or 30-06 in the 180gr weight.