I have been reading a lot about the 6.5x284. It seems to be the hot round now in BR shooting. Obviously the 6.5 caliber can be made into some very high ballistic coefficient bullets. The only draw back to the bench rest guys seems to be increased throat and barrel wear after 1000 to 1200 rounds(compared to the slower BR rounds). Obviously that would not be an issue for folks wanting to use it for hunting or more casual recreational shooting.

The Scirocco 130 grain bullet produces a .571 ballistic coefficient. A 2900 fps load would produce a round that is only 5.6" low at 300yds with a 225 yd zero (that's 2.68" high at 100 yds). Go to 3" high at 100 and your less that 5" low at 300. That's an impressive set of numbers. All with very light recoil. No proven .270, .284, or .308 hunting bullet matches that .571 BC as far as I can find.

Without getting into magnums, could you find a better ultra long range deer, lope, varmit round in a caliber that can be uploaded for larger game as well?

The .308 used to be the 1000 yard bench gun of the past. That was before all the newer wildcats. The 6.5X284 is the best as far as I can see, but the .308 will kill anything you want to hunt with it. If you want a good all aroung caliber for hunting and extreme long range shooting, then go with the .308.

If you need to shoot 1000yd.s to hit game, get out of bed! 6.5x55! .308 is a great round, but so is 8x57. dead is dead

The .308 used to be the 1000 yard bench gun of the past. That was before all the newer wildcats. The 6.5X284 is the best as far as I can see, but the .308 will kill anything you want to hunt with it. If you want a good all aroung caliber for hunting and extreme long range shooting, then go with the .308.

I am well familar with the ole 08. I have shot many a .308 round and have a few super accurate .30-06s loads developed at warm .308 levels. Still the .308 does not approach the 300 to 400 yd hunting ballistics this 6.5x284 is producing (< 5" low at 300 is sweet). A light-mag or max .30-06 is close, but then your talking a lot more recoil and it's not really a varmit through big game round. From what I can see, this 6.5x284 is the perfect ultra long range deer/lope/varmit round.

Yes, the 6.5X284 is the best as I stated earlier, but I also go along with JP and have to wonder why you need such a long range gun for deer? Just curious.

Yes, the 6.5X284 is the best as I stated earlier, but I also go along with JP and have to wonder why you need such a long range gun for deer? Just curious.

As gun enthusiast, what we need and what we want are two totally different things aren't they? :-)

Seriously, being able to take much of the range estimation (at 300-400 yds) out of a western big game hunting scenario, and being able plunk varmits comfortably with the same round is appealing.

As gun enthusiast, what we need and what we want are two totally different things aren't they? :-)

Seriously, being able to take much of the range estimation (at 300-400 yds) out of a western big game hunting scenario, and being able plunk varmits comfortably with the same round is appealing.


.308!! 6.5x55!! 30.06!! 7mm rem mag. Same thing, Bigger, Smaller, More powder, less. If it works, who cares!! If you want a hybrid that will shoot to 1000 yards, it has been done, again, and again. If I can put a .22lr in a 2" circle at 700 meters, that would be astounding. .264, 7mm, .308, .311, .323, are all great long range bullets. What about the shooter? Is he shooting off hand? Can he? Forget the Cartridge, it can't help you!

Dang, your not very much fun.

Dang, your not very much fun.

Sure we are :D I guess I'm stuck on old technology. If it can with stand the test of time, something is positive about the firearm, and or Round. Not to say that there will never be an extreme round developed, that will leave us all w/ our jaws on the ground (We can Dream) But for 99% of the hunting space in the lower 48 states, our old tried and true will outlast us all. 700 meters is the furthest I have ever shot. 50 to 200 is the norm. I have a few rifles that will drill game at 400+, but here in the North east there are no spaces that offer that kind of range. Except maybe the Highway, and then I do not believe the State troopers would be very happy. :D
JP

Sure we are :D I guess I'm stuck on old technology. If it can with stand the test of time, something is positive about the firearm, and or Round. JP

That's cool. Of course you are talking to someone that has ONLY hunted with .270, .308, .30-06, and .30-30. Hard to beat that group for "standing the test of time".

Still, the high BC and efficiency of the 6.5 interests me.

Bird Dog,
Sounds like you have your mind made up, and I would have to agree that the 6.5x284 would be as good as it gets for what you have described. Who cares if something else will do or won't do. If it's something you want, go for it!

No moss growing on the long range accuracy of my 6mm/284 either! :D

Does anybody commercially chamber a 6.5X284? What's the ballistics like on a 6.5 or 6mm X 284. Might be looking at my next toy. :D

Not that the 300 RUM wouldn't be up to the task :rolleyes:

Does anybody commercially chamber a 6.5X284? What's the ballistics like on a 6.5 or 6mm X 284. Might be looking at my next toy. :D

Not that the 300 RUM wouldn't be up to the task :rolleyes:

If I recall correctly, Norma is loading the 6.5-284, and I thought one other was loading, but now I can't remember for sure.

Don't overlook the 6.5-06; essentially the same performance, if you don't care about proper headstamp, etc.

If I recall correctly, Norma is loading the 6.5-284, and I thought one other was loading, but now I can't remember for sure.

Don't overlook the 6.5-06; essentially the same performance, if you don't care about proper headstamp, etc.

What is the loading operation to take a .30-06 case down to 6.5-06?

Some folks can make the jump from .308 down to .264 in one operation of neck reduction. Since I have a .284 neck sizing die, I include it to ease the neck down to the .264. Use lots of case lube for both the outside and the inside of the neck, too.

The case is then full length resized in the 6.5-06 die, the length trimmed back (you will draw the neck length in resizing down) and the outside neck turned to eliminate thick spots.

Actually, I find sizing .25-06 up to the .264 works best. Not as much case work and easier to do.

Bird Dog,
As with kdub, I use 25-06 brass for the 6.5-06; not much change between .257 to .264. I already have a 25-06 so I've never needed to try the 30-06 brass.

I have no need to shoot a 1000 yards but if I had a convenient place to do so I sure think it would be a hoot to give it a try.

Wouldn't the heavier cartridges excel in even a moderate 5-10 mph wind??? Something like a 30-338? Wouldn't be that bad to shoot in a 16lb rifle.

I have no need to shoot a 1000 yards but if I had a convenient place to do so I sure think it would be a hoot to give it a try.

Wouldn't the heavier cartridges excel in even a moderate 5-10 mph wind??? Something like a 30-338? Wouldn't be that bad to shoot in a 16lb rifle.

As far as wind blowing conditions YES! However, when it comes to shooting 30 rounds off the bench at 1000 yards away, the recoil of those harder hitting calibers like the .30/378 or 300 RUM and .338-Lupa start taking their toll on ones body. It ceases to be fun when your in pain savvy!

As far as wind blowing conditions YES! However, when it comes to shooting 30 rounds off the bench at 1000 yards away, the recoil of those harder hitting calibers like the .30/378 or 300 RUM and .338-Lupa start taking their toll on ones body. It ceases to be fun when your in pain savvy!

Yes, barrel and throat wear are more of an issue in those calibers as well I imagine.

Yes, barrel and throat wear are more of an issue in those calibers as well I imagine.

More like it cost you 3 times more to shoot those calibers at the bench and I am not wanting to use Ben-Gay that night after shooting them from the bench either.

One reason I love shooting the 25-06 and 243, they are much more fun for a lot longer time at the range.

aren't the case capacity of the 284 and 06 nearly identical? therefore the 284 would have the theoretical edge in the fact that it is a short action cartridge, and the action should be stiffer

aren't the case capacity of the 284 and 06 nearly identical? therefore the 284 would have the theoretical edge in the fact that it is a short action cartridge, and the action should be stiffer

I guess that's true, but in bench rest type guns, I bet all the actions are pretty beefy and stiff. For sporters, I've always thought barrel stiffness to be important. Not sure if action stiffness of shorter rounds is a true factor or not. Optimum headspace and lock-up are more critical for sure. The short action stiffness would be more a factor if the weapon was high recoiling and was fired thousands of times. I know from reading about my Encore and accurizing it, that the frames may stretch after thousands of firings. The locking and camming mechanisms of bolt guns make them much stronger, but the same may apply to them I guess. Therefore, recoil and bolt thrust would seem to be considerations, but maybe action length is too - I'm not sure.

I have been experimenting with loads for the 7mm mag and the 338 mag. In the 338 I am trying to do long range (600yd) max at my range. My long range hunting is the coyote at 200-300 with either gun(winter hunting) I have both guns braked and it makes a BIG difference on the bench. 50 rds of each in a day will feel like 100 rds of 20 gauge skeet shooting the next day using a o/u.
Jim

Well, I shot some groups with my Model 700 in 300 RUM, and was able to shoot 20 rounds without flinching or feeling pain. The day after I notice a slight tenderness of the area, but I've felt the same with my Model Seven in 243 after 40 rounds. I like the 300 RUM. :D

6.5 mm-284 reloading data is in the sixth edition of Hornady Handbook Of Cartridge Reloading starting on page 281. The Max ft/sec on the 140 grain bullet is 2700 ft/sec. In comparson the 264 Win with the same 140 gr bullet is 3,100 ft/sec.-- One may try running the 284 case into a full size 6 mm- 284 die with out the deprimer but it may be a two step procedure to get the neck down to 6mm.

I reduce the necks of standard .284 Win and 6.5x284 Win cases to 6mm/284 using progressive smaller standard neck sizing dies in 6.5mm and .257 calibers. No mean trick using a bit of inside/outside neck lube and turning the cases 1/4 turn in stages while reducing.

You will find the 6.5x284 is of slightly larger case capacity than the 6.5-06 and therefore has just a slight edge in velocities with the same weight bullets.

The 5th edition of Nosler's reloading manual calls for 6.5x284 Norma (same as 6.5x284 Win) to have a 140 gr Partition at 2925 fps with 52.5 gr of Alliant RL-22 powder, 2924 fps using 50.0 gr of IMR4831.

The 6.5-06 using the same bullet gets 2849 fps with 50.5 gr AA3100 and 2860 fps with 50.5 gr RL-22.

Forget the 6.5/284 and step-up a notch to the 6.5 Rem Mag. The Remington 673 Guide Gun is currently available in this caliber as well as the .308, .300 Rem SAUM and .350 Rem Mag.

I don't think they are selling very well so you can probably buy one for much less than the $893 MSRP. I don't like the retro model 600/660 look with its shark fin front sight and high vent rib, but I would consider one if they got cheap enough. Not in the 6.5 Rem Mag but in the "hog-busting" .350 Rem Mag, but that's a topic for a future thread.

I've shot a few rounds over the years on paper out to 350 yards. The 7mmSTW , 7mmRUM , 264 WIN MAG , 25-06 , 7mm REM MAG , 300 WIN MAG , 280 REM , 300 RSUM , 7mm RSUM , 270 WSM and the 325 WSM . And I gotta say I liked the 264 WIN MAG the best and the 25-06 second . But then I'm partial to 6.5's . A friend built a 6.5-06 AI a couple years ago and it did very nicely out to 350 yards and it should be the same as the 6.5-284 .
Personally I'd kinda like to see the 300 RSUM case necked down to 6.5mm . Then I could rebarrel a Remington Model 7 .

I've probably killed more deer with 6.5's followed by 7mm's .
In the 6.5's I've used the 264 and 260 . In the 7mm I've used the 7-08 , 280 , 7 REM MAG , and 7 Ultra .

Forget the 6.5/284 and step-up a notch to the 6.5 Rem Mag. The Remington 673 Guide Gun is currently available in this caliber as well as the .308, .300 Rem SAUM and .350 Rem Mag.

I don't think they are selling very well so you can probably buy one for much less than the $893 MSRP. I don't like the retro model 600/660 look with its shark fin front sight and high vent rib, but I would consider one if they got cheap enough. Not in the 6.5 Rem Mag but in the "hog-busting" .350 Rem Mag, but that's a topic for a future thread.

I owned a 673 in 350 and shot a friends in 6.5 REM MAG . They are not the way to go for a long range rifle . You have do mess with them to much to get them to shoot well . Before I was satisfied with the 350 I had the rib off it and had bedded and floated it . My friends 6.5 never got to what would have satisfied me . He still has his and mine was traded off very shortly after I got it to halfway shoot .
I had a 6.5 REM MAG in an old model Ruger 77R , but never shot it . Kinda wished I had now .
Personally I think the best long range rifle on the market at the moment would be Remington's "new" Sendero in 264 WIN MAG .
I had a pair of stainless fluted Senderos when they first came out 10 or so years ago . I had a 25-06 and 7mm REM MAG . The 25 killed a pile of groundhogs and the 7 killed right many deer .
That 25-06 was a consistent 1/4" rifle at 100 yards , while the best I could do with the 7 was about .4".

Bird Dog,The 6.5 284 is a great long range accurate round.Ive had a couple,just sold one with a 24" Pac nor 1-9" twist.Best I could get with 140 gr bullets was 2700 fps.The benchrest shooters are getting around 3000 fps but thats out of 29 to 32" barrels.There is plenty of data around,you might want to check Hodgdon powder website for some real world data.I also have used Vithavouri N560 but could not get close to thier published fps.The 25 284 is another great long range round,easy to neck down and very accurate down range,just a 25 06 in a short case.In chosing either round I would use a long action in a hunting rifle as the heavy bullets are very long and a short mag well dosn't allow you to seat them out far enough.Good luck with your project.David

The sixth edition Hornady Handbook Of Cartridge Reloading Volume 1 has reloading data for the 6.5mm-284 starting on page 261. Reloading data for the 264 Winchester Magnum starts on page 271. If you are looking for a long range 6.5 mm hunting rifle go with the 264 Win Mag. For target shooting the 6.5 mm-284 is a fine round.

I can kill deer in my back yard with a pistol. To shoot a 1000yd at a target and get acceptable results, now you have my attention. Is the 6.5x284 a custom rifle? I was interested in the DPMS LR 260 as a long range shooter, but picked up a lot of negative feedback on the customer service.
Jim

I can kill deer in my back yard with a pistol. To shoot a 1000yd at a target and get acceptable results, now you have my attention. Is the 6.5x284 a custom rifle? I was interested in the DPMS LR 260 as a long range shooter, but picked up a lot of negative feedback on the customer service.
Jim

Jim if your wanting a very very accurate rifle for long range shooting, in the 6.5 caliber, then I suggest the tried and true "6.5/284" is the route to go! I did a make up of a wildcat in a 6.5/300WSM. It is not near as accurate down range shooting 600, 700 and 800 yards compared to those that shoot 6.5/284 caliber target rifles.

It is plenty accurate as a 350 yard hunting rifle! However, it is not in the same league as the Long Range types that are shooting at 1000 yard tournaments and winning them with a 6.5/284 with longer barrels added to their rifles.

With 6.5-06, my Speer manual recomends fire forming a .25-06 case up to 6.5 rather than having to outside trim a .30-06 case thats been necked down because its too thick.

I owned a 673 in 350 and shot a friends in 6.5 REM MAG . They are not the way to go for a long range rifle . You have do mess with them to much to get them to shoot well . Before I was satisfied with the 350 I had the rib off it and had bedded and floated it . My friends 6.5 never got to what would have satisfied me . He still has his and mine was traded off very shortly after I got it to halfway shoot .


I agree that the 673 is not a long range rifle, but I'd like to dispute that they don't shoot well. I recently got one in 350 RM and have been working up handloads.

Over the 4th I tried a 225 gr Barnes TSX at 50 yards to see if I was on the paper. First two shots were in the same hole and the third was 1/4" away. I only had two rounds left, so I adjusted the scope and put the two shots into the same ragged hole at 3/4" above the point of aim...where I need to be for a 150 yard zero..

Granted I haven't tried this combination at 100yards yet, but I don't recall an out of the box hunting rifle shooting so well for me ever before.

I have been reading a lot about the 6.5x284. It seems to be the hot round now in BR shooting. Obviously the 6.5 caliber can be made into some very high ballistic coefficient bullets. The only draw back to the bench rest guys seems to be increased throat and barrel wear after 1000 to 1200 rounds(compared to the slower BR rounds). Obviously that would not be an issue for folks wanting to use it for hunting or more casual recreational shooting.

The Scirocco 130 grain bullet produces a .571 ballistic coefficient. A 2900 fps load would produce a round that is only 5.6" low at 300yds with a 225 yd zero (that's 2.68" high at 100 yds). Go to 3" high at 100 and your less that 5" low at 300. That's an impressive set of numbers. All with very light recoil. No proven .270, .284, or .308 hunting bullet matches that .571 BC as far as I can find.

Without getting into magnums, could you find a better ultra long range deer, lope, varmit round in a caliber that can be uploaded for larger game as well?

In a word NO! The 6.5/284 or the 6.5/06 or the 6.5/06 AI with the 130 Sirocco's will be the best flat shooting non-magnums you will find. I believe an action similiar to the Rem 700 ('06 length) would be the one to go with if you haven't made up your mind already. My 6.5-06 was built in the '60s on an '03 Springfield action and 3-shot groups under an inch are routine. The rifle is very capable.........I am not so sure about me but I am still working on improving the "nut behind the bolt"...a never ending battle.

Ol' John

PS...Forget the magums for ranges to 400 or less....waste of time, effort and money..........especially money!

Have a 6.5-06 on a Brizilian M1908 action/Shilen barrel and it shoots the 120 gr Sierra Prohunter with aplomb.

Also have a 6.5x257 Robt's AI on the ol' Swede M38 (Husqvarna) action/Van Horn bbl. It shoots the 129 gr Hornady SST's wonderfully.

Naturally, all the customized and original Swede M38's and M96's in the vaults respond well to the SST's, also.

Kdub....I went to the rifle range with a friend this aftenoon, as the weater was just to hot to do anything but sit at the bench with a roof over my head firing my rifle.

I got some great groups using a 300-Ultra mag and Barnes new tSX bullet in the the 180 grainers. Wow! I could hardly believe what I was seeing through my spotting scope. The two of us took turns shooting this model 70 stainless Winchester.

There were various groups fired but the one that did us both proud took place in the second go around. I fired 3 shots that were clover leafed and 2 more shots that were 1/4 inch from the first three and those were also touching each other. My friend put shot on top of one another and a third shot less than 3/8 of an inch away from the first hole. The rifle is shooting well under 1/2 groups for 3 shots fired. I am a happy camper to say the least.....It's a keeper too. :D

Been having a lot more luck with the TSX bullets than the older Barnes bullets, myself. Sorta touchy in seating depth until I found what each chamber wanted to handle as far as distance off the lands. Bores don't copper foul near as badly, either.

Still like the SST's, though! :p

Been having a lot more luck with the TSX bullets than the older Barnes bullets, myself. Sorta touchy in seating depth until I found what each chamber wanted to handle as far as distance off the lands. Bores don't copper foul near as badly, either.

Still like the SST's, though! :p

Kdub I like those Sierra bullets for punching holes in paper and for varmint hunting. I agree that finding the sweet spot for those TSX bullets is a bit of a headache but my main thing with these bullets, is that they open up and mushroom. I had many of those X bullets and XLC blue's that didn't open up in a couple of tests I ran.

I am mainly working up for 2 rifle calibers, a .338 Win mag and my 300-Ultra mag. So far they are good to go right now. Both these are shooting under an inch off the bench.

I have little experience with rifles in these calibers but once I shot an acquaintance's AR with a 20 in. barrel chambered in 6.5 Grendel and it was dumbfoundingly accurate. I didn't attempt to hit targets towards 1000 yds, but I was knocking down human-size steel silhouttes at 200-450 yds in rapid succession with no scope adjustment, something I've never been able to do without atleast using quick holdover estimations. In my .308 AR that has a 22 in. barrel, I had to make 2-5 MOA scope adjustments to get on target at these ranges.

I got a 21/25 targets in 3 1/2 minutes with the Grendel, I got 16/25 in 3 1/2 minutes with the .308. I don't know what ammo this guy was using with his 6.5 Grendel, but I am really impressed so I ordered a 6.5 AR upper from Alexander Arms and a whole bunch of brass and it should be arriving in about 4 days.

But what I'm trying to figure out is how well the 6.5 Grendel stacks up to the 6.5/284 and the 6.5/06?