Has anyone reloaded for these? If so does it make any differance who manufactores the brass? Are the special mil.spec primers by CCI needed to help with slam fire? These are basic questions, but I have only started with these weapons. Any help will be appreciated.
Bill

Brass doesn't really matter, but harder brass such as IMI Match or Remington, as well as military are what I use, because of the rougher trip that the brass takes during the loading, firing and ejection cycle. I started using the CCI Military style primer (CCI 34?) after experiencing a slamfire using Federal Match primers. Don't use any slow powders for your handloads, as the pressure curve of slower powders puts alot of stress on components such as op rod, bolt and recoil springs. IMR 4064, IMR 4895, Varget, and WW 748 all work well for me, others will have their favorites. I like Sierra Match King bullets, either 155 gr or 168 gr for match use, and any good 150 gr bullet for everything else. The 147 gr FMJ's have not really worked out for me, but your mileage may vary, should you use them. Beware that some of the cheaper ones are steel jacketed with a copper wash on them, and could cause accelerated bore wear. For plinking and general shooting, British surplus Radway Green is very good, brass cased, berdan primed, non corrosive ammo, if you can find it. J&G sales in Arizona used to carry it, but I haven't bought any lately, so don't know if they still do. I hope all of this helps. Enjoy your M1A, it's one of the better rifles out there.

MrBill,

I load ammunition for my STG-58 (metric FAL). It is an autoloding rifle chambered in 7.62X51mm. I load my ammunition on Lee Dies. I use Winchester 748, Winchester Large Rifle primers, Remingto brass, and Winchester brass. I have expended thousands of handloaded rounds without any malfunctions.

The Fal firing pin does use a spring to retract it into the bolt after firing, so this is a bit different from your M1A; however, I have expended thousands of handloaded .223 Remington rounds in my Mini-14 and AR-15 without any malfunctions. Both of these rifles have floating pins. I load my .223 amunition with Winchester 748, Remington brass, Winchester brass, and Winchester Small Rifle Primers. I cannot discern any differnce between Remington and Winchester brass.

My experience tells me that cartridge overall length, full length sizing, and a proper crimp are very important. I prefer Lee dies, but I have used other makes as well. They all work just fine.

Welcome aboard! :)

Best wishes,
Rushbeau

Has anyone reloaded for these? If so does it make any difference who manufactures the brass? Are the special mil.spec primers by CCI needed to help with slam fire? These are basic questions, but I have only started with these weapons. Any help will be appreciated.
Bill

I reload for the M1A. M1 Garand and AR15 using standard Winchester rifle primers. The danger of slam fires appears to be overrated. If the primers are properly seated there should not be a problem. I run high power rifle matches every month and most of the shooters reload for their rifles which are ARs, M1As and M1s. These folks use standard rifle primers. After fire years of these matches and thousands of rounds expended, we have never had a slam fire on the line. All the best...
Gil

I have been present at large events at Camp Perry where slam-fires have occurred. I do not know the particulars of the loads involved? High primers (not properly seated) are always a possibility. I use a Neil Jones primer pocket depth uniforming tool and a Wilson primer pocket profile uniforming tool (which also cuts away military crimps) to ensure I can bottom out a primer with a slight recess below the plane of the casehead. I have used Federal 210M primers this way with no problem, but have just come back from Commercial Row at Camp Perry with 5000 of the CCI 34's to try out. The Federals have a better reputation for consistency of charge force. The CCI's are magnum strength for better ignition of ball powders.

This last point matters. Using the Federal primers I found 100 yard group sizes fired from my M1A off bags with a scope on a B-Square mount using Accurate 2520 powder (a ball powder) dropped from 1.25" to 0.75" when I deburred the primer pockets. Deburring can make quite a difference in flame spread and the ball powders need all the help they can get to light up. I have heard using magnum primers is another way to solve the problem, hence the 34's. With stick powders the deburring made no difference. The ball powders are desirable because they meter more accurately and consistently. The stick powders are more desirable from the standpoint of immunity to ignition problems and they allow you to use weaker primers which the benchrest folks swear give best accuracy. A world of trade-offs. I will just have to see how the 34's do?

Winchester cases are semi-balloon head cases based on their design change for the '92 Palma match rounds (which it was our country's turn, as host, to issue). These have more powder capacity than standard military brass to enable the 155 grain Sierra MatchKing Palma Match bullets (also specially developed for the '92 Palma ammuniton) to remain supersonic out to 1000 yards when fired from a 30" Palma rifle barrel. The harder military brass holds up to semi-auto loading and extraction better. I use the Winchester for long range slow-fire single loaded ammunition and military brass for magazine-fed ammunition.

I stopped buying the 168 grain Sierras after two bad experiences at long range from a 24" tac gun. One was in trying to shoot a 748 yard popper during a PR1 class at Gunsite, and another firing from the 800 yard line at Camp Perry during the Long-Range Firing School. In both instances, the bullets began to tumble at about 700 yards, where they enter the difficult trans-sonic velocity range. Everyone firing 168's on these occasions had the same problem, and this was from a variety of bolt and semi-auto rifles. Nobody using 168's could hone-in on the Gunsite popper (this was the whole class, since we had all bought PMC match ammo at the school that was loaded with these bullets). At Camp Perry the target pits reported lots of misses and hits that were keyholing. In this latter instance everyone ran to Commercial Row after the first day of firing and bought HSM match ammo loaded with the 175 grain Sierra MK’s from Champion’s Choice (then the only commercial match ammo loaded with these bullets). The second day of firing there were no routine misses or keyholes.

Out to 600 yards, the 168 gr. MK is fine. The newer, more ballistically efficient 175 grain MK was developed in cooperation with the military as a long range sniper bullet subsequent to the 1985 JAG opinion that the small, non-expanding hollow point in a match bullet does not constitute a violation of the Hague Accords. It is also a virtual match in weight to the old M1 Ball boat-tail bullet (174.5 grains +0/-3 grains) the 1-in-10 twist military barrels were intended for. Very accurate, less affected by wind and able to take full advantage of the extra powder you can put in a Winchester case. I still use the 155 grain Sierra MK’s for offhand and sitting sustained-fire loads at 200 yards. I find 300 yards begins to show wind effects enough to prefer the heavier 175 grain bullet for that range, despite added recoil recovery time expended.

Nick

Excellent thread, brought home a Springfield National Match M1A Wednesday. Tried some 147 FMJBT Win reloads with IMR4895. I guess I need to go a little higher pressure because 1/3 of them did not fully function the action. Federal cases, IMR 4895 at 43.5 grains, Win 147 FMJBT, Winchester primers. Did not have much time to check accuracy or chrono these with a week long thunder storm that is still going on right now. Will load some of the 173gr FMJ surplus bullets and try them over the weekend.

. . . 1/3 of them did not fully function the action. Federal cases, IMR 4895 at 43.5 grains, Win 147 FMJBT, Winchester primers. . . Will load some of the 173gr FMJ surplus bullets and try them over the weekend.

The 147 grain Winchesters are the worst .308 bullets I've ever fired. I can't make them group in anything. My dad bought 500 of them at a gun show about 20 years ago and after neither of us could get them to hit the broad side of a barn from the inside, he gave them away to a begining reloader. Your maximum load with those funky little FMJ's will likely be nearer to 46 grains of IMR4895, with velocities in the 2800 fps range.

You'll like the 173's better if they weren't pulled from decomissioned ammunition. They can usually be got to shoot down close to 1 m.o.a. They are maybe 1/2 as accurate as the 175 grain Sierra's will be when new and in good condition. It depends on the lot. Some were better than others. In the Federal case, figure 41 to 43 grains of IMR4895 is where you will likely end up. Work up from 41 grains in 0.2 grain increments until you see the groups tighten up. The M1A, with its gas mechanism, is a little touchy for the standard .3 grain increment used in ladder shooting.

I recommend you use Dan Newberry's round robin technique (http://www.clik.to/optimalchargeweight) with the M1A. You will need 3 rounds of each powder charge level you test. Use standard maximum OAL to determine seating depth so you have reliable magazine feeding later. Load each of these test rounds singly by pushing them into the chamber with your thumb and letting the bolt slam closed. This carries a small risk of slam firing, so keep the muzzle pointed downrange when you load. You do this to get the bullet and case neck into the restrictions of the chamber before the bolt closes. That keeps the bullet from tipping in the neck, as it is inclined to do when slamming up the feed ramp on the barrel during magazine feeding. Letting the bolt slam closed ensures any headspacing change to the case from the bolt closing still occurs and you are firing something close to what you will magazine feed, but with a more accurately seated bullet.

Use 5 of your junk 147 grain rounds to foul the barrel before starting the testing.

Nick

P.S. Newberry lists 42.4 grains of IMR4895 as an optimal charge weight in the Winchester case with the 175 grain Sierra MK. The Winchester case has more powder capacity than your Federal, so you are likely to find a sweet spot a little below that in a Federal case.

Excellent unclenick. I appreciate the response. The load info sounds right where I should start.

Carried one of these in the Marines, but they supplied the ammo.

You guys have given me a lot of info. It's really great to be able to connect with folks like you. I am really glad I joined this forum. As I said I am new to the M1A, have shot the M1 for years. With the M1A I have finally acquired all the weapons I was qualified with in the service. Thanks again for the info.
Bill