I called Dillon today and asked this question.

On your 550B what would you consider to be normal for messing up primers?

The answer he gave me was 1 out of 10.

He also said that CCI and Federal were the worst and recommended either Winchester or Remington primers.

I've got a LEE Loadmaster and loaded 150 rounds of 40S&W today and had 4 primers to mess up. I have been thinking about getting another progressive because of the primer issue with my Lee, but after talking with the person at Dillon I'm not so sure. According to him I could have had 15 bad primers out of the 150 I loaded and he would have considered it normal.

I have also been thinking about the RCBS Pro 2000. This press gives you two options for priming, the primer strips or the tubes. I just have to believe that the primer strips would work.

Please tell me your real world experiences with your brand of progressive press and how reliable it is seating primers.

Thanks!
Slufoot

I have the RL 550B and I LOVE it, I've loaded thousands of rounds for everting from 40S&W to 458WM, I've probobly messed up LESS than 5 primmers, and I contribute it to two things #1 the "cartidge spring" not being set with enough tention to hold the shell into the shell plate FIRMLY, #2 the primmer pocket on the particular shell (military crimp)

The primmer slide must also be ajusted CORRECTLY!

And I've never used any primmer but a CCI!

What's messing up ? I use a RCBS Piggyback for 4 different calibers. The only problem I run into sometimes is loading a high primer. It seems that comes back to finding a proper match of primer brand to brass brand. CCI primers seem to be the tallest. Wicnchester and Remington seem to be the easiest to get along with. What are you trying to say?

Hello bert621.

What's messing up ?
What are you trying to say?

I get alot of primers that are seated into the primer pocket sideways. I also get no primer seated and I have even seen primers seated backwards.
I hope this makes my problem more clear.
Thanks!



Hello Wrench Man.

Thanks for the information about your 550B.
I couldn't believe it when the man at Dillon told me "1 out of 10". If that were the case people would be cussing Dillons instead of praising them.
Have you ever had to call Dillon for a problem and if so, how did it go?
How long have you had your 550B?

Thanks!
Slufoot

Thanks for the information about your 550B.
I couldn't believe it when the man at Dillon told me "1 out of 10". If that were the case people would be cussing Dillons instead of praising them.
Have you ever had to call Dillon for a problem and if so, how did it go?
How long have you had your 550B?
The ONLY problem I've had is that I broke the lip out of the shell holder for the 30-30 with a stuck case, which is weird because I've pulled the rim off of 338WinMag shells!?, I scraped those dies and have had no further problems.
I called Dillon and told them the problem, they gave me a return # and told me to send in the broken part, a new one arived about a week later, no questions asked!

And the statment about the CCI primers being the tallest, makes sense, they must be seated fully! you can feel them seat and if they are not atleast flush you can "feal" it when you go to index the shell plate.

And I will tell you that the RL550B is an *** to set up!, but once it's right you can realy whip them out!
It only takes about 45minuets to load 500 40S&W's!

Out of tens of thousands through my Dillon Square Deal and fewer, but still many, through my 550B, and having run a friend's 1050 quite a bit, I would say that with everything set up correctly, one in 300 to 1000 is more like it. I had a period with the Square Deal where I got an inordinate number of sideways and flipped primers starting to occur, but it turned out I had simply worn out the plastic feed fingers on the stationary primer tube. A quick replacement solved it. I've always used Federal primers.

You have to keep grime that cakes up cleaned out. Periodic tear down and cleaning of the priming mechanism and shell holder are needed. Ditto the powder measure. Both I and the 1050 owner have found that the plastic primer chaser rods have inadequate weight. I went to a brass rod sometime back, though you have to collar it to trip the warning buzzer. My friend simply adds a weight to his plastic follower after the first twenty or so primers have been used. This ensures positive downfeed and puts a stop to any tendency of the last primers in the tube to flip over during descent. This last matter used to be a common Dillon problem before they had any chaser rod at all. The first primers in the stack have no issues because the weight of the stack itself keeps the bottom sorted out.

One in 10 just isn't possible unless you have something wrong.

The only problems I had with primers in my Dillon were before I replaced the feed tube lips (the plastic parts). I bought the press second-hand, so who knows how old it was.

I do watch the primer feed carefully on any progressive press, but the rate of issues is way lower than one in ten.

My RCBS Ammo Master has done several thousand .45s. At first, I had trouble with primers fipping, but I found a small burr in the primer tube where the cotter pin goes across. Deburred it, and no further problems.

Of course, I'm ignoring the occasional NT small-primer case or mil-crimp case that I fed it!

Have been loading handgun ammunition on a Star progressive since '63 and can honestly say that my Star has NEVER flipped a primer or put one in sideways regardless of primer brand. A case with no radius or chamfer around the primer pocket may jam the primer. Have learned not to continue putting pressure on the operating handle when this happens. Slightly rotating the case in the shell holder usually clears this up. Have had to proceed slower using Sellier & Bellot cases due to their tight primer pockets.

Find it AMAZING that Dillon would tell you that 1 out of 10 failures to prime is considered normal. Might have been referring to his experiences with another reloading tool.

. . . A case with no radius or chamfer around the primer pocket may jam the primer. . .

That's why I like the profiling reamers, though I don't take the time with pistol brass; only for match rifle brass. Pistol I run through the Dillon swager. I once bought 1000 new bulk IMI Match .45 ACP cases on sale, and had to run them all through the swager. Even hand priming tools had problems with them.

. . . Find it AMAZING that Dillon would tell you that 1 out of 10 failures to prime is considered normal. . .

That is astonishing to me, too. I would write a snail-mail letter to Mike Dillon about it. I am sure he will put whoever said it straight and will provide a more believable number. I was wondering if maybe one in ten Dillon owners call back with a primer problem to resolve? That I could believe, since primer feed is one of the touchier elements in any progressive. I am also sure they resolve them.

I was surpised to hear Dillon doesn't like the Federal primers I use. Not as tough as CCI, which may worry Dillon? The one time I tried CCI in my Square Deal, I got a number of high primers. This was before I bought the swager for tight pockets, and suspect such pockets were to blame. No problem with CCI magnum primers on the 550B, though.

Pistol I run through the Dillon swager. I once bought 1000 new bulk IMI Match .45 ACP cases on sale, and had to run them all through the swager. Even hand priming tools had problems with them.

I think the Dillon swager is a first class tool! Don't have one but from the pictures, believe the leverage on it is awesome and that it would take little leverage to do large batches of military brass quickly.

I use the RCBS primer pocket swager attachment on the Rockchucker and find the only drawback with that is the cases tend to become a press fit on the end of the hardened swager button and it takes a bit of muscle to free them. For the money, it sure beats the Lyman hand primer pocket reamer which can mis-align the primer pocket by taking off too much material. Like you, I once had a large quantity of RA '63 .45 ACP brass with crimped primer pockets to ream. Painstakingly did this with the Lyman tool and that is how I ended up with many squared-mouth primer pockets that were difficult to prime in the Star. I stick mainly with commercial cases now and seldom have to swage primer pockets.

. . . from the pictures, believe the leverage on it is awesome and that it would take little leverage to do large batches of military brass quickly. . . it sure beats the Lyman hand primer pocket reamer which can mis-align the primer pocket by taking off too much material. . .

The Dillon has so much leverage that it actually cracked the body casting when I first got it. Dillon sent me a new one without hestation, and that's lasted over a decade. Works very fast. It retracts the swaging punch below flush with the slip plate that lets the case swing up for releas, so the brass is never stuck on it.

I cut profiles into match rifle brass using the Wilson tool I got from Sinclair (http://www.sinclairintl.com/cgi-bin/category.cgi?item=05-420&type=store). That inexpensive tool is designed so it maintains perfect case coaxiality with the cutter based on first principles. It does so whether you are trimming or reaming inside necks or primer pockets. The only cutter they didn't make for it when I got it years ago is a primer pocket depth uniforming cutter. I use a Neil Jones tool for that. They may have such a cutter now, but I haven't checked for awhile.

The reason I cut rather than swage military rifle brass is the swaging process forms a swell of brass around the primer pocket perimeter (the brass has to go somewhere). If you rub the head of a swaged case over a flat metal surface, this stands out. It's not enough to affect pistol accuracy, but on a bench gun it slightly shortens headspace and stops the brass from resting squarely on the boltface. That increases the chance of slight bullet yaw in the barrel. Firing flattens it back out, but you may have to re-swage as some of the flattened swell flows back inside the primer pocket perimeter. Usually the second swaging and reloading and firing is the end of the problem. Nonetheless, this means I can't quite trust swaged rifle brass to give me best accuracy before the third reloading.

I personally only know two rl550b owners, and they both admit to priming with an autoprime off the press before running the primed cases through the progressive. They also deprime with a universal deprimer on a single stage press prior to tumbling. I wonder how many "closet", off-press-priming, progressive owners are really out there?

Seems like the other Dillon users have pretty well answered your problem. Out of curiosity how much trouble do you Dillon users have with the indexing process. Does everything line up properly all the time, with all the calibers; or do the larger calibers do better than the smaller ones?

. . . Does everything line up properly all the time, with all the calibers; or do the larger calibers do better than the smaller ones?

No alignment issues. The shell plates have holes in them that a spring-loaded ball bearing clicks up into for registration. On the 550B you feel and hear it. Being manually indexed, it's a zero failure situation. On the Square Deal and 1050, the pawl that advances the shell plate completes its stroke and drops below the plate and lets the ball and inertia nudge it the last fraction of a turn. That can hang up if the press gets dirty under the shell plate. Cleaning cures it. I suppose, if you have a plate approaching the need for cleaning, a heavier cartridge with more inertia might keep working a little longer before the cleaning absolutely has to be done?

Most of the time primer pockets don't have to be cleaned out, but after about 10 reloads (and this is another thing the Dillon guy might have meant?) you start getting high primers due to primer residue build-up. (Particularly with Winchester primers another forum member said, but I haven't kept track.) At that point you do indeed need to size and decap, then clean the primer pockets before completing the loading cycle. I also manually prime cases for match rifle shooting using the K & M tool, but that is because its funny leverage system allows feeling the primer bottom out in the pocket so you stop before compressing or indenting it; two things said to make ignition timing and intensity vary. It also uses a spring-loaded collar to get the primer perpendicular to the primer pocket before it starts in. Good tool, but strictly one-at-a-time.

Alright, I guess I'll jump in with my couple of cents worth..
I own an RCBS Pro 2000 and use the strips. I did have a little trouble at first, but the problem was mainly with me just learning the machine. After I got the hang of it I believe those strips are the greatest thing since sliced bread. I also had a bent primer ram ( you have 2 with this setup, one for large and small primers.) and RCBS promptly sent a replacement. As others have stated, the crimped primer pockets will give you grief no matter what brand of loader you end up with. I just pitch them.

Hi JR454, you are the first person I've got to talk (type) with that owns a Pro 2000. Could you please tell me more about your press.
I went to Gander Mtn. and they had one on display and I thought it was a well built looking press.
How reliable is the primer system?
How hard is it to change over to another cartridge?
Any other likes or dislikes?

Thanks alot!
Slufoot

Hi there Slufoot,
I'll be glad to tell you more about this thing.
I've had it for about 5 yrs now and the only thing I had problems with was priming, untill I learned the machine. And once I learned it, it has worked flawlessly.
The main thing I liked about the press, (and its what helped me choose it over the Dillon) is the powder measure. I prefere it over the 'slide bar' style. You are provided with 2 cylinders, one for low charges (for pistols) and the other for larger charges.
As far as caliber conversions, the die holder and shell plate are kind of expensive, about $15.00 and $24.00 respectively.
But it is pretty easy to change over. Like anything else, the more you do it the quicker you get. Took me forever the first time...just trying not to screw up. The thing I would modify on this thing is the spent primer catcher. Consists of a tube with a little bottle on the end. I remove the bottle, file down the flared end and put a waste basket under the tube. No real biggie.
It has a cast iron frame, but the die holder is aluminum, (as is Dillons). I would preferre steel, but there may have been a reason they used aluminum.
Lets see, another thing, it is manually indexed, which is a plus. The die holder has four stations, so you can crimp separately.
I know this is starting to sound like a commercial for the product, but I am certainly satisfied with mine. To be honest, I would have been just as satisfied with the Dillon too, but I ended up with the RCBS, with no regrets.
If you think of anything else to ask, I'm snooping around on this site all the time.
Later!

My first experience I had with a progressive was when a buddy of mine bought a Lee Loadmaster some time back in the late 1990's. The primer feed on that one was a major PITA. It continually jammed, and broke several times. The whole thing eventually went back to Lee. Seeing what my buddy went through with that one turned me off to Lee equipment completely.

I checked out several different types of presses pretty thoroughly before I bought one. I finally decided on a Hornady Lock-N-Load AP. I reload primarily .45 acp and .44 mag. I don't recall ever having a problem with the primer feed on mine, other than making sure you don't run out of primers. I'm very pleased with mine.

. . . The main thing I liked about the press, (and its what helped me choose it over the Dillon) is the powder measure. I prefere it over the 'slide bar' style. You are provided with 2 cylinders, one for low charges (for pistols) and the other for larger charges. . .

Sounds like the regular RCBS Uniflow drum measure I bought about about twenty-five years ago. It measures ball powder quite well. I later bought a Redding 30-BR, which is the same basic drum-style mechanism, but with a concave micrometer tip to elimenate corner-filling irregularities and is limited to the range of 10-50 grains. It does even better with 748 for long range .223 loads than the Uniflow, though not by a lot.

My only complaints about the steel drum measures is how hard they cut stick powders and a tendency they have to almost jam on large flakes, like Unique. I've found the Dillon slide bar to be a bit more forgiving on those if it is kept clean, though I do not find it has any better inherent accuracy, which makes the point essentially moot.

I am currently playing with the JDR Quick Measure, which has the potential to be a truly superior measure and can be adapted to the Dillon and probably to any other progressive that advances the cartridge rather than the dies. It takes a bit of machining (though JDR makes an adapter for the Dillon that you can buy) and it drops powder slowly, so you have to use it at a relaxed pace. Nonetheless, I've had a few runs of up to a dozen throws that were within two hundredths of a grain of each other on my lab scale. Thus far, these have always been followed by a throw that changed a tenth or even two (with stick powder) same as any other measure. But still, the potential is there for it to be a truly better all-around mouse trap. Its design prevents it from cutting or jamming on grains at all, though you will feel it hesitate ever so slightly on them sometimes.

I love both my Dillon presses. 1050 and 550B. My next press will be the 650 should I ever need another one. I have never had a problem with my 550B you could blame on the press. I lost a spring in the sandy bottom of my old shed. The new spring was in the mail the same day. I bought a spare parts kit I have never opened. My primer slide bar actually short stroked ofter thousands of rounds. This was the first time I realized it was necessary to clean this area.
I changed over my 1050 from 40sw to 45acp when it was new, and the only problem was the weight issue with the feed tube, and adjustment. I suppose I should clean my brass better, but why have the 1050 if I have to handle each piece anyway? Never had an index problem, or any other issue. The primer problem was frustrating, and Dillon was very helpful, no matter how much I cussed the press,and other things.
The worst part was buying all the stuff to change it over for several calibers, and not needing or using it!The 650 would have given me the extra station for the powder check die, auto progressive, and will do rifle, and pistol equally well. When Mike Dillon says "No B.S. Gaurantee", he means it!
I bought my first Dillon in the early 80's and I have an assortment of dies that all work.I personally prefer Dillon Dies, with Redding a close second. ( I think Redding used to make Dillon Dies).I prefer tool heads ready to go for each caliber, including powder dispensers.
If you want the best, Star would be hard to beat. For the overall experience I have had with Dillon I would not consider any other at this time.

I want to thank all of you for sharing your experiences about your presses.
I have just found out that Santa Clause (my wife) is getting me a Pro 2000 for Christmas.
I can't wait!
I'll have a LoadMaster for sale on ebay before long.
Thanks again!
Slufoot

I want to thank all of you for sharing your experiences about your presses.
I have just found out that Santa Clause (my wife) is getting me a Pro 2000 for Christmas.
I can't wait!
I'll have a LoadMaster for sale on ebay before long.
Thanks again!
Slufoot
Congratulations Slufoot! You can't go wrong with a gift from Santa, no matter what the brand...
Merry Christmas! :)