I hate cleaning lead out of pistols and revolvers about as much as a toothache.

Even with mild loads recommended for lead bullets and good quality "hard cast" slugs, it seems inevitable that leading will build up in forcing cones, chambers and barrels.

I couldn't find a Lewis Lead Remover kit but located a similar product by Hoppes. I cannot make it work at all. As soon as I attempt to pull it through the bore, the screen rips. All attempts to adjust the screen holder and rubber expander from "barely on" to "tight and expanded" have failed in .38 and .45 handguns, using the appropriate parts.

I've read the Hoppes kit is identical to the Lewis kit other than a different handle. Is the Lewis kit better? Are there any tips or tricks I should know?

I pretty much gave up on lead bullets and started buying plated or jacket bullets, but I have a LOT of cast lead bullets sitting in the shop I'd like to use.

Any suggestions?

Thanks very much,
desmobob

did you ever hear about Mercury ?? that silvery liquid looking stuff ??

yes !! that Mercury !

i have been cleaning the lead from pistol and revolver barrels with Mercury for over 40 years, in fact i have bought some really fine hand guns from ignorant people who thought their barrel was shot out.

providing you are not afraid of the hype about Mercury, you will find that is the best and easiest way to remove lead fouling, Mercury will disolve lead.

take your pistol/revolver and plug one end of the barrel securely and fill the bore with Mercury and let set for an hour or two, pour the Mercury into the container you keep it in, take a nylon bristle brush (NO METAL BRUSHES PLEASE !) brush the barrel slowly holding the open end of the barrel over somthing to capture the exiting residue, i use a plastic pan, after a reasonable amout of brushing check the bore, it should look like the day it was new, if some lead residue persists repeat the process.

...providing you are not afraid of the hype about Mercury, you will find that is the best and easiest way to remove lead fouling...


Umm... I think I'll pass on the Hg method. :rolleyes:

Good shooting,
desmobob

I've used the Lewis Lead remover quite a bit, and never tore a screen..... hmmm. Shouldn't be that hard to pull through the barrel. How bad is the leading, anyway?

Umm... I think I'll pass on the Hg method. :rolleyes:

Good shooting,
desmobob


to each his or her own !!

try a bit of hydrogen peroxide, stuff works great, but ensure the barrel is plugged and only leave in for about 5 min, it will remove all of the leading. But get it on the blued steel and it will start rusting that day. Once all the Hydrogen Peroxide is gone, oil it down really well. you will be surprised, I use it on all my Lead bullet guns. Les

The easiest way to remove lead for me is using a "pan scrubber". Go to Walmart and buy a pack of Chore Boy or similar COPPER mesh pan scrubber. Cut off a piece and wrap it around an old bore brush so it has a tight fit in the barrel. You will be amazed at how quick it removes the lead. Remember, get the COPPER kind.

Jim

I've used the Lewis Lead remover quite a bit, and never tore a screen..... hmmm. Shouldn't be that hard to pull through the barrel. How bad is the leading, anyway?


Not a lot of leading at all. In my revolvers, the screen rips as it's trying to fold back on its way into the forcing cone. It's as though the screen is too thick or inflexible. At first, I thought maybe the end was mislabled or out of spec, but the same thing happens when using the .45 caliber adapter with the kit in my Colt 1911 barrels.

I guess I'll have to buy the Lewis kit. That's the one most people mention when talking about lead removal. Maybe the Hoppes kit looks similar, but isn't as good.

Thanks,
desmobob

try a bit of hydrogen peroxide, stuff works great, but ensure the barrel is plugged and only leave in for about 5 min, it will remove all of the leading. But get it on the blued steel and it will start rusting that day. Once all the Hydrogen Peroxide is gone, oil it down really well. you will be surprised, I use it on all my Lead bullet guns. Les


That sounds interesting.... cheap, too.

One of my revolvers is stainless. I wonder if the hydrogen peroxide could damage the finish?

Thanks,
desmobob

The easiest way to remove lead for me is using a "pan scrubber". Go to Walmart and buy a pack of Chore Boy or similar COPPER mesh pan scrubber. Cut off a piece and wrap it around an old bore brush so it has a tight fit in the barrel. You will be amazed at how quick it removes the lead. Remember, get the COPPER kind.

Jim

This is the method I ended up using and it does seem to work well. It's the easiest? :(

I don't know if I'd call it "easy", but if it's the easiest, I guess I'll stick with it. :cool:

Thanks for the suggestions,
desmobob

i have been cleaning the lead from pistol and revolver barrels with Mercury for over 40 years,
Doesn't mercury evaporate in the air and isn't it absorbed by skin? It may work fine but I think I'll pass on that too. Would recommend an Outers Foul Out III if nothing else works.

Hydrogen Peroxode is a heckuva lot cheaper, still even with stainless you will want to oil it down well when you are finished. Plus no gawdawful smell that most lead and copper removers have. Hydrogen Peroxide will not work on copper. Les

Doesn't mercury evaporate in the air and isn't it absorbed by skin? It may work fine but I think I'll pass on that too. Would recommend an Outers Foul Out III if nothing else works.

Hg is some B-A-D stuff... most uses and all manufacture have been banned in the US.

I remember back in Jr. High science class when a vial of mercury was passed around so you could pour it into your hand, slosh it around, and observe its unique properties. :eek:

Marshal Kane,

I have always been intrigued with the Foul Out system and have come close to buying one several times. I'll probably end up with one eventually.


Good shooting,
desmobob

Some good tips on cleaning here. The hydrogen peroxide works best 50/50 with white vinegar.

http://www.frfrogspad.com/homemade.htm

The easiest way to remove lead for me is using a "pan scrubber". Go to Walmart and buy a pack of Chore Boy or similar COPPER mesh pan scrubber. Cut off a piece and wrap it around an old bore brush so it has a tight fit in the barrel. You will be amazed at how quick it removes the lead. Remember, get the COPPER kind.

Jim
I use this method, too. Works great. Wouldn't put those nasty corrosives in my barrel since this is available.

I would expect vinegar, an acid, to be a good bluing remover, so watch out if you use it!

Chore boy. The only way. Makes quick work. I would rather clean my lead shooters than my copper shooters anyday.

i bought some of the lewis lead remover screens along time ago to use with a regular cleaning jag.... i had trouble with them tearing too.... i do use a brass bristle brush and hoppes and lots of scrubbing to get em clean.. then a really tight patch pushed through the barrel... i'm another one who'll stay away from mercury thank you...............


life is short..............

I can shed some light on the use of Mercury for cleaning lead from pistol barrels.Quite a while back I had a Walther P38 9mm that i managed to lead the barel frequently.I had a ready supplyof Mercury so I used it for all my deleading projects.
I knew very well that it was dangerous.Shortly before,a Long Island Family bought a home,and soon developed health problems.Their dog died and their young son became very ill.
Investigation discovered that the prior owner had spilled some Mercury onto a rug in the house.The boy was permently disabledand the two adults had to undergo long painful and expensive 'heavy metal'treatment.
You can be sure that i wa very careful.I usee it for about 20 years without any problem at all.I traed the P38 for a Ruger 357 revolver and never needed the Mercury again.
In smnation;You can use it only if you are careful by nature.and have a real hate for scrubbing barrels.
Today i have the Outer's foul out reverse plat

ing system which works very well with badly leaded bores.
Frank

Howdy guys !

I've used the Lewis lead remover and it certainly works. The trick is to get the tension just right.

Another product is a lead removing cloth. It's yellow in colour. Just can't find it at the moment to tell you the brand. Iv'e found it to be the easiest. Maybe G96 brand ?

Mercury - jeez - that stuff is poison.

But no-one is helping our poster out !

We need to know why the pistols are leading up in the first place.

What type of projectile is being used ? homecast ? swaged, commercial hardcast ?
What diameter in relation to the bore ?

And powder weight and burn rate / type is important.
Too fast a powder can melt the base of the bullet.
Too low a charge can fail to seat the bullet correctly allowing the flash to bypass the base and get into a lube groove.

What do the cases look like after firing ?
Do they show soot indicating failure to fully seal the chamber on firing ?
Have the primers backed out slightly ? Again, a sign of low charge.
Are the primers cratered from too powerful a charge?

If these paramaters are known, then we can help our mate to avoid leading in the first place.

Respectfully,

Kirby.

Besides all the bad things stated about Hg it should be remembered that men with gold weddings rings(or anything gold for that matter) don't want to put them anywhere near Hg. It will raise cain with gold!!!

The following is a letter found on a web site:

Separating mercury from gold jewelry Feb 16, 2002

I got mercury from a broken thermometer on my gold wedding ring, and it bonded to the gold. Jewelers won't touch it. I asked a chemist in my area what to do. He suggested silver cleaner which didn't work. I'm obviously not a science expert; I'm an elementary school teacher. I've done some reading about nitric acid. Can I put my ring into plain nitric acid and separate the mercury from the gold? Any other piece of jewelry would be replaceable, but my wedding ring means far too much for me to replace it. I'm afraid to wear it with the mercury still on it. I don't know what to do. Can you help me?
Thank you,
Nancy Wilson
- Fitchburg, MA, USA

Jean
You are in big trouble;trying to seperate gold from mercury.
The reason that mercury cleans lead from the bore better then anything else,is that it amalgamates with the lead.It forms a lead/mercury mixture that pours out completely,leaving a pristine clean bore.
Mercury also amalgamates with gold,which is closly related to lead.That's the reason old time alchemists tried to make gold from lead.
Don't wear the ring.Consider it as 'lost',and replace it with a new one.
Frank

Hydrogen Peroxode is a heckuva lot cheaper, still even with stainless you will want to oil it down well when you are finished. Plus no gawdawful smell that most lead and copper removers have. Hydrogen Peroxide will not work on copper. Les


Never tried Peroxide, sounds interesting, but I think I'm addicted to the smell of Hoppes. I don't think is smells bad at all. Some of my fondest memories are the smell of gunpowder, leather, and sweatin horses. Do I hear banjo music............easy dollar.........

I hate cleaning lead out of pistols and revolvers about as much as a toothache. . . Any suggestions?

The best trick is to avoid leading in the first place. If you have guns that are picking it up, you may be running loads too hot, bullets sized too small, or bullets made with a poor lube. Get or make good quality bullets. If you think poor lube is the culprit, coat them in Lee Liquid Alox to get a second layer. To check whether you bullets are correctly sized, run an oil-soaked patch down your clean bore, then oil a bullet and use a brass hammer to start it into the muzzle, followed by a long enough wood dowel to tap it the rest of the way through the bore. It should come out marked by the rifling all around with no gaps in any of the groove impressions standing out on its surface. In a revolver, this bullet should now fall through all the cylinder chambers without needing to be tapped or hammered. If it needs tapping or hammering, the cylinder throats need to be reamed (cylindersmith.com (http://www.cylindersmith.com/)).

Firelap your barrels. Get Marshall’s book and kit (http://www.beartoothbullets.com/bulletselect/index.htm).

Mixing hydrogen peroxide with vinegar creates peracetic acid. This will dissolve lead into lead acetate. Lead acetate is poisonous to ingest, as well as being an environmental hazard. The Romans used it to sweeten wine, which is how they got sterile and depressed and lead colic and nuts. (Lead acetate is the main ingredient in the Foul Out electrolytic solution, too, and both should be disposed of in accordance with local hazmat regulations.) Peroxide alone will create some lead hydroxide. It needs to be understood that either of these compounds will act, albeit more slowly, on steel and activate its surface. That’s why after-rust occurs easily where you have used them. I would strongly recommend you treat a bore cleaned this way by rubbing back and for the with tight patches coated with Flitz, or Maas, or Gunbrite, or some other polishing and waxing compound to de-activate the surface.

Where these chemicals attack steel, the lead acetate reaction product does not. The Outer’s Foul Out will remove the lead without attacking the steel provided no rust is present. If there is any rust in the bore, it will dissolve into the solution making an iron electrolyte and the system will then start removing iron. The instructions tell how to determine whether this has happened by checking the color of the electrolyte before it can go too far.

I’ve had good luck with the Lewis lead remover and don’t know what the issue you’re having with the Hoppe’s version is? A limitation of the bronze cloth is that it doesn’t bend down into the inside corners of the lands, so lead tends to remain in them to be brushed out.

I have soaked unlubricated cast bullets in several of the commercial cleaning compounds that claim to be for lead. None of them actually etch the surface. Mostly they just try to seep in under it lead deposits and loosen them so a brush will more easily get them off. My dad says he likes how the Shooter’s Choice Lead Remover solution works. He gets to clean or oversee cleaning of university pistol team guns, most of which are air guns, .22 LR or .32 wad guns. So the metal fouling is all lead. I would say it seems to work better than the standard bore cleaners when I’ve tried it on .38 and .357 barrels. I’m lazy and like the Foul Out better.

I would be careful of Mercury, and avoid it if you’ve never had a quantitative analysis class or some other training that taught you about residual traces of materials. I used to use it decades ago, but discovered that in brushing the amalgam out, tiny beads of mercury came out on the brush and the bristles springing as the brush exits the bore were flinging these all over the basement. I learned to brush these bores out down inside a wastebasket, but even then there would be little beads caught in the rifling corners that later would be vaporized by propellant gases. The metal itself is not unsafe to handle, but breathing its vapors or ingesting it is. The trick is handling it so as to avoid contamination that might do those things, and in that regard it can turn into something of a tar baby. Under a magnifying glass I remember finding little tiny beads caught in the ridge lines of my fingertips. Wiping and shaking just moved these little guys around. It took a lot of soap and hot water to convince them to contaminate the sewer system rather than me. So, you need disposable gloves and a containment box at least. It just isn’t worth turning your house into a hazmat site. That won’t help its resale value.

Howdy guys !

I've used the Lewis lead remover and it certainly works. The trick is to get the tension just right.

Another product is a lead removing cloth. It's yellow in colour. Just can't find it at the moment to tell you the brand. Iv'e found it to be the easiest. Maybe G96 brand ?

Mercury - jeez - that stuff is poison.

But no-one is helping our poster out !

We need to know why the pistols are leading up in the first place.

What type of projectile is being used ? homecast ? swaged, commercial hardcast ?
What diameter in relation to the bore ?

And powder weight and burn rate / type is important.
Too fast a powder can melt the base of the bullet.
Too low a charge can fail to seat the bullet correctly allowing the flash to bypass the base and get into a lube groove.

What do the cases look like after firing ?
Do they show soot indicating failure to fully seal the chamber on firing ?
Have the primers backed out slightly ? Again, a sign of low charge.
Are the primers cratered from too powerful a charge?

If these paramaters are known, then we can help our mate to avoid leading in the first place.

Respectfully,

Kirby.

Hi Kirby,

I gave up on the lead bullets a while back, but I'll tell you what I remember.

The pistols were two Colt .45ACPs, a S&W Model 66 .357, a Taurus .38 Special and a Colt Single Action Army in .45.

The .45 ACP bullets were 3D brand swaged 200gr. SWC (the swaged bullets may explain the .45 ACP leading?) over 5 grains of Bullseye. This is a very popular load, I believe. I have a box of 500 Midway brand "Extra Hard Cast" 230gr. RN but I don't think I've shot any of those. I had become frustrated with the lead bullets and never loaded any. They might be considerably better than the swaged ones, right?

In the .38 and .357, the bullets were from a case (2840 bullets) of "Winchester Component Bullets" 148gr. hollow base wadcutters shot over the classic 2.7 gr. of Bullseye. I just pulled out a handful of these bullets. I don't see any sign of lubricant on them! :eek: That may explain the .38 and .357 leading!

The Colt SAA was shot with Meister Bullets Hard Cast 255 gr. .452 and 250gr. .454 bullets. This revolver has the darned oversized cylinder throats common in the latest Colt SAAs (a .454 bullet will fall clean through the cylinder.) They were loaded with Unique at typical .45 Colt lead bullet velocities (well under 1000 fps). I can't remember if I had a lot of leading with those loads or not.....

Looking back, I'm guessing that knowing what I know now, I never would have bought the swaged bullets, or the apparently unlubricated wadcutters. I guess I'll have to buy some equipment to lube the rest of that case of wadcutters! I think I must have about 2500 or more left. (Worst part is, I think I have about 200 or more already loaded.) :-(


I appreciate all the responses to my question. I think avoiding swaged bullets, lubing my wadcutter bullets, and trying again may have me thinking differently about shooting lead bullet loads.

Hopefully, I'll experience less leading. And now I have more information on how to deal with it!

Thanks very much for all your help; I really do appreciate it,
desmobob

Some good tips on cleaning here. The hydrogen peroxide works best 50/50 with white vinegar.

http://www.frfrogspad.com/homemade.htm


Thanks Joe... I actually have the frog's pages in my "favorites" file but didn't think to look there for tips.

Good shooting,
desmobob

Swaged bullets are very soft and have to be run very slow. The 'unlubricated' ones may have a thin, wax-type lube. You'll also have to have the barrel absolutely clean and free of any other copper or lead fouling, then work up loads that will shoot accurate and not lead. It should be possible.... there is some work involved, but if I had 2500 bullets laying around, I'd sure give it a try. You might tumble-lube a few with some Lee Alox and see if that helps. At least it will be a simple and cheap experiment.

The Midway bullets are HARD, as a general rule. I've shot them and they lead if you don't run them hard enough (high enough pressure). Not sure if that is going to be possible in the .45 ACP, and with standard pressure .45 Colt loads. The big cylinder throats on the .45 Colt revolvers won't help matters. I've seen them used in full-power .44 mag loads and they didn't lead a bit, by the way.

Can't comment on the Meister bullets.

Best of luck.

Swaged bullets are very soft and have to be run very slow. The 'unlubricated' ones may have a thin, wax-type lube. You'll also have to have the barrel absolutely clean and free of any other copper or lead fouling, then work up loads that will shoot accurate and not lead. It should be possible.... there is some work involved, but if I had 2500 bullets laying around, I'd sure give it a try. You might tumble-lube a few with some Lee Alox and see if that helps. At least it will be a simple and cheap experiment.

The Midway bullets are HARD, as a general rule. I've shot them and they lead if you don't run them hard enough (high enough pressure). Not sure if that is going to be possible in the .45 ACP, and with standard pressure .45 Colt loads. The big cylinder throats on the .45 Colt revolvers won't help matters. I've seen them used in full-power .44 mag loads and they didn't lead a bit, by the way.

Can't comment on the Meister bullets.

Best of luck.

Thanks Mike.

I looked at the wadcutters very carefully under the shop lights and also scraped them with a fingernail and lightly with my knife. Only tiny lead shavings came off....

I just came from the Midway site. I already put a couple of bottles of Lee Alox in my shopping cart. The reviews were impressive. I hope it helps. Friday is payday and it's almost time to send in an order!

Thanks once again,
desmobob

The best trick is to avoid leading in the first place. If you have guns that are picking it up, you may be running loads too hot, bullets sized too small, or bullets made with a poor lube. Get or make good quality bullets. If you think poor lube is the culprit, coat them in Lee Liquid Alox to get a second layer. To check whether you bullets are correctly sized, run an oil-soaked patch down your clean bore, then oil a bullet and use a brass hammer to start it into the muzzle, followed by a long enough wood dowel to tap it the rest of the way through the bore. It should come out marked by the rifling all around with no gaps in any of the groove impressions standing out on its surface. In a revolver, this bullet should now fall through all the cylinder chambers without needing to be tapped or hammered. If it needs tapping or hammering, the cylinder throats need to be reamed (cylindersmith.com (http://www.cylindersmith.com/)).

Firelap your barrels. Get Marshall’s book and kit (http://www.beartoothbullets.com/bulletselect/index.htm).



I will definitely try the Alox and the bore/bullet check.

I have all the materials in the shop for fire lapping (bought the super-fine abrasives from a guy that used to be in the glass industry), but have read so much negative stuff about it, I've never used it. (I just read another negative opinion on Mike Bellm's site.) I would certainly be willing to try it in the Taurus.... :rolleyes:

Thanks for the interesting lesson on the chemistry of lead removal. I have no desire to mess with mercury. Dealing with all the lead in the hobby worries me enough!

I'm glad I found this forum. What a very thoughtful and helpful bunch hang out here! I hope I'm able to help someone out sometime.

Good shooting,
desmobob

I use the Chore Boy (might be called Chore Girl) method since I read about it in Veral Smiths book. Its the best and easiest. Also works on plastic in shotgun barrels.

Des,
you have helped others by seeking answers to problems all shooters face at some stage.
So you're part of the team mate !
Heck - over 270 + people have viewed your post - fantastic.

I'm also a fan of Lee Alox lube. I've never had leading problems with any of my cast bullets coated with this liquid gold !

Kirby.

I've used a 50/50 mixture of hydrogen peroxide and white veniger to clean out a stainless Anaconda and I'll tell ya right straight up it'll loosen up leading quicker than yer grandma can dab turpentine on a cat's butt!!

Unclenik
Your post with chemical analysis of hydrogen peroxide and mercurycould be posted in 'Tech Notes'.
I only wonder why you brushed the mercury/lead amalamum out with a brush.there is an inherent 'spring'action of the brush that will spread the tiny round balls all over the landscape.I would never do that;The amalgamum is a liquid and flows oiut by simply dumping it.Then I swab the bore wit a tight fitting cloth patch.Of course,I follow with a cleaning cycle with Hoppe's.
Thanks
Frank

I've used a 50/50 mixture of hydrogen peroxide and white veniger to clean out a stainless Anaconda. . .

Stainless is not activated easily because the mixtures won't attack its chromium oxide protective layer. There are some other things you can get away with in stainless, like the battery operated ammonia solution home made electrolytic cleaners. Just don't use one in chrome-moly steel if you don't like rust.


just read another negative opinion on Mike Bellm's site

It's not something to be done blindly, but I wasn't much impressed by Bellm's comments. For one thing, I've used firelapping to remove constrictions from several Garand barrels. During the process, I used a military throat wear gauge to monitor progress and found the throat moved forward only about 0.001", while diameter came up about 0.0001" at the muzzle. Not nothing, but all well within normal tolerances for new match barrels. Keep in mind these barrels started tight at the breech by about 0.0003", so a total of about 0.0004" was removed back there by the time the barrel was straight (constriction removed plus the portion removed at the muzzle).

Another thing I noticed is Bellm refers to casting pure lead into drilled holes for firelapping bullets. Pure lead is often used in hand lapping, but is a poor choice in firelapping because even light loads will bump pure lead bullets up to cut metal from wide spots after passing through a constriction. There is some good agreement among firelapping kit makers that the best job is done by cast bullets in the range of BHN 11 to 15 (depending how much taper you want to create) with a consensus that hardness in the neighborhood of BHN 12 is the best typical compromise between hardness and inelastic soft bullets for typical guns.

Bellm used up to 220 grit Clover compound. That is too coarse. If you look at particle distributions for standard compound grades, like Clover, you find the largest particles are about twice the size of the average. I would not be surprised that he saw some excessive wear using 220 grit. I have used abrasive as coarse as 240 grit, but it was lab grade with a much narrower particle size distribution, so my largest particles were probably only about a third the size of Bellm's. Marshall's kit uses standard grade, but 320 grit, so his kit's largest particles will be slightly smaller than mine were.

Bellm mentioned borescope observation, but nothing about the use of slugging to monitor progress and know when to stop. Looking only at tool marks is not an adequate indicator, especially when you use bullets that are too soft.

Bellm suggested re-chambering after firelapping, then breaking in. Well, if you leave chamber reamer tool marks in your throat, guess what? You've got a source of fouling. So now your back to needing to shoot break-in rounds (another process of disputed value) where a firelapped barrel is already there. (Chambering after lapping a bore is like chambering a hand-lapped custom barrel; see comments at the end.)

Bellm mention David Tubb's use of firelapping. Tubb likes to remove chamber reamer throat tool marks with his Final Finish system, but this process uses very fine abrasives, and I do not believe it is intended to be up to the removal of constrictions. It is just for resurfacing, and so is not really the same thing as firelapping.

In the end, Bellm used materials and procedures not recommended by those experienced with firelapping, and presented the result as evidence firelapping may do undesirable things. As a bonus, you get to copy his improper methodology without the expense of a kit. Hmmm.

To get firelapping right, you need to read something by someone whose done a lot of work and experimenting developing the process. You need bullets cast in the correct hardness range. You need pure lead slugs for slugging the bore to feel constrictions so you can stop when they are cleared. It is true that you don't have to buy a kit to get there, but I would recommend that you do so for your first time out, just to be sure the materials and instructions are correct at the start. You can cast your own lapping bullets later, but be sure you have a means of testing bullet hardness and use it to get a direct comparison to one of your lapping kit bullets. Most home-use hardness testers have poor absolute accuracy, but are good for comparing two samples to see if they are the same?

If you have a hand-lapped, custom barrel, even though David Tubb would further polish it, I suggest you look at the January 2007 issue of Precision Shooting and its article on a dual method of barrel break-in. Nobody I know has seen accuracy improvements from firelapping new custom barrels. At that point it is about achieving ease of cleaning and the ability to shoot more rounds before needing to clean. The hand-lapping described in that PS article for removing chamber reamer tool marks from the throat is probably a better approach to take with a new custom barrel to get absolute maximum barrel life.

. . . The amalgamum is a liquid and flows oiut by simply dumping it.T

As far as I know, the amalgams are all solid at room temperature. Certainly the ones in dental fillings are. I always found a gray chalk-like deposit in place of the lead after the mercury soak. A patch would get a good portion out, but a brush was needed to clear out all traces. Back then I wasn't using JB bore compound or Iosso Bore Cleaner and the like. Either would have done the job without a brush.

This was well over 20 years ago. Perhaps I didn't leave the mercury in long enough? Perhaps the stuff would have flaked off or dusted into the liquid if I'd been more patient? I don't know any other way to explain the discrepancy?

The spring in the bronze bristles sure can throw things. I don't even brush solvent out into the air anymore. I got one of those plastic capture container similar to what Sinclair sells (http://www.sinclairintl.com/cgi-bin/category.cgi?category=CPMI&item=03-6000&type=store).

. . . I have soaked unlubricated cast bullets in several of the commercial cleaning compounds that claim to be for lead. None of them actually etch the surface. . .

After I wrote this I realized I had not done the experiment recently. I got out some bullets and tried three cleaners I didn't have the last time out. Of the these, two actually did etch the bullets after about 24 hours. One was Bore Tech Elimenator. This stuff is more rapidly active on copper than any other bore cleaner I ever tried. Apparently plugging and filling a bore with this stuff will act on lead.

The other is a homemade cleaner I concocted by neutralizing the acidity of a rust chelating agent with ammonia. I have to try out the mix to be sure it no longer etches steel (the acid version does, if left long enough). If it works out, I will publish the mix instructions. The chelating approach has the advantage of tying up the lead in a an organic molecule. Chelation is used to remove heavy metals from blood, so these molecules effectively tie up the lead so can't do harm to you. It should eliminate the hazmat considerations.

Kragman71


It wasn't my ring. I was quoting a lady in the web site I listed. Thanks for the advice anyway!

Unclenik
All the Mercury that I used was retrieved from old electrical switces that was in a liquid form.Also I had enough supply that it never got contaminated and sludgy.Even with a sizable amount of solid leadinfused,it still flowed freely.I also never soaked it.I plugged the chamber with a rubber plug,poured enough into the barrel to about 1/4full,held my finger on the muzzle,and tilted the barrel back and forth 3 or 4 times,and poured it out.
EZ do.
Frank

Frank,

A friend of mine who worked at a power plant gave me a bottle of switch mercury, too. Mine all had a certain amount of gray scum on top. I also built a couple of mercury stills for my college's P-chem lab when I was still blowing glass, and had some recovered mercury from those that I used in McLeod gauges and diffusion pumps originally. I wonder if your tilting technique loosened the amalgam? It doesn't sound like you had much lead to start with? I was usually getting it out of the barrel of a Dan Wesson .357 that had a very rough forcing cone and throat. It would cake up thickly in there. I just pulled the barrel and set the throat end into the mercury bottle and left it there. I don't recall for how long, but it was probably a couple of hours.

When either lead or copper build up, it is usually in alternating layers of metal and carbon plus lubricant. I suppose it might have mattered what lube I was using back then? Nothing worked on that gun until a tool maker I knew used an internal toolpost grinder to clean the tool marks off the forcing cone and throat.

Unclenick
There was nothing wrong with the barrel of my P38 pistol.I just pushed the lead bullets too fast through the bore.I was young and the barrel was easy to remove to clean with the Mercury.I never had to deal with a barrel with a buildup of different substances in it.
However Mercury (Pure Mercury)is a liquid at room temperaature.You evidently did not have that to work with.
Frank

I found Libman copper scouring pads today that say 100 % copper. I hope they are. The last ones I bought said that too and they were not. Can't find the Boy or Girl anywhere. They must have got tired of doing their chores.

. . . However Mercury (Pure Mercury)is a liquid at room temperaature.You evidently did not have that to work with.
Frank

Hmmm? Maybe were talking past each other, somehow? My mercury was liquid, same as any other. It was just the lead and mercury alloy (amalgam) that results from the reaction of the two metals in contact with one another that was not liquid. After I removed the barrel from immersion in the mercury, where there had once been caked-up lead that was hard to brush out, there was now instead the gray chalk-textured almalgam that was soft enough I could easily brush it away.

My comment about the tool maker might be a little confusing. I meant to say that no lubricant spared that barrel from leading until the tool maker had done his magic. Then the bore cleaned reasonably. I don't think I really needed the mercury treatments after that.

If you start off clean, really clean of copper fouling, I found that Kroil brushed through and left for awhile, depending on how lead fouled things are, will lift the stuff off. Using it in a Ruger 5 shot custom .480 Ruger with CPBC bullets, the lead peels out in little flakes and strings. Same for .45 Colt and the SRH in .480 Ruger. Barrels have to be broken in with shooting and cleaning using JB Bore paste followed by JB Bore Bright. I use the gas checked Beartooth bullets to reduce fouling in early going. After shooting and cleaning, Kroil the barrel lightly and put it away, that stuff seems to penetrate the pores and form a shield. Swab the bore with a dry patch before shooting.

I have also used the Puff-Lon filler in rifles with cast bullets, it has dry lubes in it and seems to reduce leading while enhancing accuracy, at least in the .45-70. It's a bit messy though, blows that pinkish/beige powder all over everything at the range, hunting it wouldn't matter.

Some factory revolvers just won't shoot any lead bullets without looking like a solder pot, while others clean up easily. I always seem to get the solder pot kind.

The other alternative is to use National Bullet Company's "copperized" cast bullets that are plated and lubed with no exposed lead. They don't lead up a barrel.

I don't cast bullets anymore, after many years welding I breathed in enough fumes and suffered enough burns, so I plunk down the money and buy them. Good luck lead peelers!

Interesting about Kroil. I use the benchrest shooter's approach of running two patches of Kroil followed by two patches of Iosso Bore Cleaner (like JB) followed by two more patches of Kroil to clean my match mouse gun. I never occurred to me to try it as a soaker for lead. Thanks for the tip.

I just tried the 50/50 Hydrogen Peroxide/white vinegar solution in my 4" S&W Model 66. It had thin, smooth lead deposits along the entire length of the barrel (from "shooting it clean" with .357 jacketed loads after shooting .38 wadcutters). A quick examination showed a nice, shiny bore. A very close look showed smooth, shiny lead "solder" streaked from forcing cone to muzzle.

First, I brushed with a copper bore brush and Hoppes. I did that until I was tired of doing it. Then, I used J.B. Bore Paste several times. I was still getting black patches even though the bore looked a lot better. I could see stuff along the edges of the lands.

I brushed it out again with Hoppes and dried it with a tight dry patch. I mixed a 50/50 solution of peroxide and vinegar and filled up the barrel. After three minutes, I dumped it. No evidence of anything happening in the bore. Nothing showed on a dry patch. I brushed it with Hoppes again and dried it.

I gave it another three minutes with the barrel filled with the peroxide and vinegar solution. Nothing on the patch again. Maybe a light coating of lubricant remained in the bore, keepin the solution from reacting with the lead?

Of everything I did, the J.B. seemed to be the most effective. Another hour or two and I might have got all the lead out. :(

I'm saving up for a Foul Out system! :p

I HATE CLEANING LEAD OUT OF HANDGUNS!!!!

Good shooting and thanks again for all the suggestions and interesting posts.

desmobob

Pot scrubber method as described in the hints on this site. Why do folks resist? It is so easy and cleaning lead becomes much easier than cleaning copper. It can't harm the bore or the rest of the gun and it takes just a couple swipes.

Pot scrubber method as described in the hints on this site. Why do folks resist? It is so easy and cleaning lead becomes much easier than cleaning copper. It can't harm the bore or the rest of the gun and it takes just a couple swipes.

I'm not resisting....

I have a Chore Boy scrubber in my cleaning kit and do use that method. As a matter of fact, the Model 66 I was cleaning last night HAD been brushed out with Chore Boy and I thought it was lead-free when I put it away last. Careful examination with a bore light showed me the lead still in it. The bore looked so shiny and smooth at first glance, I thought it was spotless.

I was interested in trying the Hydrogen Peroxide/Vinegar trick as it sounded pretty easy.

The pot scrubber method seems to fairly easily remove the large deposits but doesn't get the thin streaked-on stuff up against the edges of the lands. (They make a mess when you cut them up, too.)



I guess I'm looking for the kind of results that only the Foul-Out can give. Either that, or I have an unrealistic idea of how clean I should be getting my pistol bores. :rolleyes:

Good shooting,
desmobob

These old eyes could be not seeing that. My revolvers are 38 caliber or bigger and the groves are not that deep cut. Those little corners in there could have a build up that I don't see.

Anybody with a bore scope got any info for us?

Lead does stick in the rifling's inside corners because patches and other mechanical cleaners can't squeeze, bend, or fold easily into them. Brushes get in, but often aren't strong enough gouge lead out because hard cast alloy is slippery like a soft babbitt and the bristles are bent forward. (Note: never reverse a brush's direction inside the bore: it can mark the steel.) A patch on a jag is usually just too thin to fill out into the corner. Only chemical or electrolytic cleaning will knock it out totally.

The best way to detail the bore mechanically is to use the benchrest cleaning technique of starting with a bronze brush one size too small fore the bore and wrapping a two or more patches around its bristles to achieve a good tight fit in the bore. The bristles help push the patch into corners and the thickness of a second patch layer provides more material to squeeze in. Coat it with JB, or Iosso Bore Cleaner, and go to town.

By the way, all these abrasive cleaners will produce blackened patches. That color is micro-fine particle of steel abraded from the surface. It isn't enough to make a measurable change in bore dimensions over a normal gun's lifetime, but metal is what is there. Lead, of course, comes away more easily than steel, and so darkens the patch faster.

If you are an ambitious do-it-your-selfer, you can build your own electrolytic cleaner from the design I did for Father Frog's (http://www.frfrogspad.com/imprvdcr.pdf) web site. It works with the Outer's solutions. I don't recommend the simpler ones on the sight that work with ammonia solutions because of a report in The Fouling Shot that the type caused after-rust in conventional steel barrels. In stainless guns, people seem to get away with using them, but I would watch carefully for signs of etching if you try it.

The best way to detail the bore mechanically is to use the benchrest cleaning technique of starting with a bronze brush one size too small fore the bore and wrapping a two or more patches around its bristles to achieve a good tight fit in the bore. The bristles help push the patch into corners and the thickness of a second patch layer provides more material to squeeze in. Coat it with JB, or Iosso Bore Cleaner, and go to town.


This is the technique I use, although I didn't know it was a benchrest trick. I thought I invented it when I ran out of new brushes and tried to add new life to an old worn-out one by building it up a bit with patch material. :p Turns out this works better than a new brush. The patch helps keep the solvent where it needs to be and picks up the crud as it comes loose.

I have looked at a few web pages with DIY electrolytic devices and they do look fairly simple. I'm usually a DIY project kind of guy, but I'm going to play it safe and buy the Foul Out III from Outers.

Good shooting,
desmobob