I bought a couple boxes of these bullets last summer with the intent of working up a good elk load for my BLR. Unfortunately things got in the way of those plans and I had to drop the project before really getting started.

Last weekend I decided to revive the plan for the 2007 season and set out to build some test loads using IMR 4895. I had received some load data from someone at Barnes last year and used that as a basis. It called for 46.0 - 50.0 grains of this powder for loading the XFB. Barnes claims that it's possible to safely reach 1 - 2 gr over this with the TSX in some rifles. I recognized trouble from the moment I metered out the first charge of 46.0 gr. In new WW 358 cases 46.0 gr fills the case to almost the mouth. With some tapping I managed to get the powder level down enough to seat the 225gr bullet to 2.77 OAL. This continued until at 48.0 gr I was not able to seat the bullet "permanently" due to powder compression. If I used enough force to seat the bullet it would engrave in the seating stem and be pulled back out when the ram was withdrawn. How anyone could ever reach 50.0 gr of this powder is beyond me. I metered out the same charge in a once fired reformed 308 case that I had on-hand and it was filled even higher on the neck (the reformed cases are shorter). The new brass all measured about 2.010 so wasn't short. I recalibrated my scale and checked with weights...right on the money. No way to reach an acceptable OAL for the Browning with anything but 46.0 to 47.0 gr. And a crimp would probably be required to insure they stay that way. I'll probably crimp anyway but it bothers me that I HAVE to crimp to keep the cartridge assembled!

Has anyone else tried this bullet in the 358 Win? As much as they cost I don't plan on punting the project. Most likely I'll have to change to a denser powder. I've got an email in to Barnes on this and hope they can get around to answering me soon. Does anyone have a telephone number for Barnes tech support? Once I get something worked up I'll post the results on LoadSwap. Many sources have touted this particular weight TSX as being a good all around bullet in the 358 Win. Hopefully they're right.

Have you tried a drop tube? I've loaded IMR 4895 with the 225 TSX and was able to load 51.0 grns without a drop tube. I didn't work on the load too much, a project I can work on some more this year. I did chorny the 50.0 grn load at around 2400 fps in my BLR. I found a number for Barnes:

(801) 756-4222

Really, 51.0 gr? So something is definitely different here. Do you recall what OAL you used? Does anyone know the approximate weight of water the 358 Win displaces? Were your cases new or previously fired? I was pretty well full at the starting load. A drop tube would have helped at that point but not too sure at 48.0 and beyond...at least to meet the 2.780 OAL the Speer manual called out as max.

Thanks for the info. I'm encouraged but mystified.

Bart,

I have been handloading the 358 Winchester for many years but have never loaded the Barnes 225 grain TSX. I am not saying that 51.0 grains of IMR4895 can not be loaded into the 358 case and the Barnes 225 TSX seated to an OAL of 2.780, but think that it would be very challenging. I have loaded 51.0C grains but with the 200 grain Hornady SP.

The 358 Win case capacity in gains of water is 57.191 gross. Here are the net H2O capacities with several popular bullets with a loaded OAL of 2.780":

225 gr. Barnes TSX........................ 42.583 .
250 gr. Hornady Spire Point............. 43.523 .
200 gr. Barnes TSX ....................... 43.853 .
200 gr. Barnes "X" Flat Base............ 44.615 .
250 gr. Nosler Partition................... 44.945 .
225 gr. Sierra Soft Point Boat Tail..... 47.283 .
225 gr. Nosler Partition................... 47.867 .
180 gr. Barnes "X" Flat Base............ 48.429 .
200 gr. Hornady Spire Point............. 49.188 .

Good luck.

Gents,

Excellent information, I am following along intently. The science involved explains allot, I've certainly bounced around allot with the BLR 358, but mine has been all trial and error. I can see the challenge that a long bullet would generate, espiecally coupled with an IMR powder.

I had the same issue with my 350 Rem Mag and 250 grain bullets, and solved the problem by going to Win 748, which settled nicely. Trying the same in the 358 and the 220/225s have not achieved the same degree of success, as for some reason my Browning doesn't like ball powders. The fellow at Accuratte advised that I ought to keep pressures up as much as possible, and that would help. Haven't gotten back into it as of yet.

Anyway, if your BLR is like mine with ball powders, it might not be a bad thing to go a little quicker burn rate, 3031 coming to mind. 2400 fps might be a challenge for this powder though.

In related news, I bought a Ruger Hawkeye in 358, and as a second order affect have de-scoped my BLR, and I like it like this new BLR arrangement pretty well, thus far. The irons on the gun are pretty good, as you know, and I'm looking forward to trying it out with the Horn 250.

I've been following RD's postal match progress, and apparently there were not many Brownings shot in the match last year, and I don't think any 358s at all. I think the lions share of the shooters fire Marlins, and the 444 bunch is the most vocal majority. In fact, I think that we Browning shooters have been gently encouraged to put up.

M1, I have seen some of your targets, and I know you can shoot that thing well enough to really give that Marlin Bunch a run for their money. I'm sure the rest of you fellows can make yours sing as well, and I would certainly like to see Browning and the wonderful 358 cartridge represented. That said, I intend to give it a go, although my time is not my own, still subject to the needs of the Army.

What do you fellows think?

Steve

I had the same issues with varget even through a 6 inch drop tube any thing over 47grs would simply push the bullet a 200gr spirepoint out over the OCL listed for that load. No way could I get the 51 listed as max.
I used H4895 and 46grs is just at the bottom of the neck maybe slightly starting up. Had no issues loading 48.5grs for a compressed load with the hornady SP 200gr.
I also loaded 46.5grs of H4895 with the 225 partition it is yielding 2430fps from a 20" barrel and is most likely not max but I stopped there without actual reloading data for those components.

Sounds like I'm not exactly on new ground here. IMR 4895 really looks like one of the better powders to use with this bullet and I really want to make it work. Maybe I'll try a longer drop tube. A big part of the problem here is that the TSX is probably longer than just about any other bullet of same weight. I wish IMR offered a "short cut" version of their extruded powders...that might help some too. Every little bit will help. I am having a hard time imagining that 50+ gr of this powder will even fit in my cases. Will try that this weekend just to get an idea if it's even possible.

RE: the postal match, count me in assuming I can get time to work up a load that will be accurate enough and not cost me a paycheck to shoot. These are not them!

Really, 51.0 gr? So something is definitely different here. Do you recall what OAL you used? Does anyone know the approximate weight of water the 358 Win displaces? Were your cases new or previously fired? I was pretty well full at the starting load. A drop tube would have helped at that point but not too sure at 48.0 and beyond...at least to meet the 2.780 OAL the Speer manual called out as max.

Thanks for the info. I'm encouraged but mystified.

You got me curious so I went down and threw some IMR4895 with 51.0 grns into a fired, unsized cartridge and a resized and primed one and took a picture of each. The 1st is the unsized, the 2nd is sized brass. I think originally I did use new brass with this load. I don't recall what my OAL was but it funtioned in my BLR magazine. It is a compressed load but as you can see, it fit fine, this was without a drop tube.

Gents,

Trying the same in the 358 and the 220/225s have not achieved the same degree of success, as for some reason my Browning doesn't like ball powders. The fellow at Accuratte advised that I ought to keep pressures up as much as possible, and that would help. Haven't gotten back into it as of yet.

Anyway, if your BLR is like mine with ball powders, it might not be a bad thing to go a little quicker burn rate, 3031 coming to mind. 2400 fps might be a challenge for this powder though.

I've been following RD's postal match progress, and apparently there were not many Brownings shot in the match last year, and I don't think any 358s at all. I think the lions share of the shooters fire Marlins, and the 444 bunch is the most vocal majority. In fact, I think that we Browning shooters have been gently encouraged to put up.

M1, I have seen some of your targets, and I know you can shoot that thing well enough to really give that Marlin Bunch a run for their money. I'm sure the rest of you fellows can make yours sing as well, and I would certainly like to see Browning and the wonderful 358 cartridge represented. That said, I intend to give it a go, although my time is not my own, still subject to the needs of the Army.

What do you fellows think?

Steve

My Browning doesn't seem to like ball powders...at least AA 2520, I'm going to try W748 this spring. I'd love to go to the postal match and shoot it out with the BLR with the 358. My BLR is a shooter and I think I can do well...but telling the boss at work for the time off....I'll have to see.

You got me curious so I went down and threw some IMR4895 with 51.0 grns into a fired, unsized cartridge and a resized and primed one and took a picture of each. The 1st is the unsized, the 2nd is sized brass. I think originally I did use new brass with this load. I don't recall what my OAL was but it funtioned in my BLR magazine. It is a compressed load but as you can see, it fit fine, this was without a drop tube.

I size everything, new or fired. So mine would look more like your sized one, although the unsized one looks more like my new, sized case with 48.0 gr. These 225 TSX bullets are long suckers. I was seating to about 2.77 (or at least trying to) and the last TSX groove was showing completely. That's a lot of bullet inside the case. I wonder what the practical max OAL is for my rifle with this bullet...will have to try that one too.

Another thing I noticed during this exercise on Sat was that my Hornady 358 dies expand the neck more than my Lee 356 dies. So I'll likely stick with the Lees since more neck tension helps keep the bullets in place. With either one though there was a surprising amount of "spring" during the seating process. I could seat repeatedly and feel a lot of movement each time. Nothing surprising here, just a side effect of VERY compressed charges. I have loaded compressed charges before and usually I can overcome the case capacity problem with a lot of case tapping. This technique only worked for the 46.0 and 47.0 charges.

Thanks for the information guys. This is all good information. At least now I would feel better about pulling a trigger on one of these without standing behind the tree and pulling a string!

Once I get past this little problem I'll start thinking about an accuracy load for the postal match. What bullet/powder combos have you guys found to have the best accuracy potential in your BLRs? I've only loaded Hornady 200gr RN and SP so far with H4198 and these weren't anything to write home about. Oh...and what dates does this match run? (nevermind... here it is http://gunloads.com/fam/ranchdogmolds/PM/ )

Anybody try magnum primers with the spherical powders? They should help ignite the dense powder charge more consistently.

Gents,

I did use magnum primers with the ball powders, most of the time, and the one time I did not was with AA2520, it was way less than satisfactory. This was a starting load as well, I think about -2g in the Hornady book- and that prompted my communication with Accuratte who advised pushing it max or just off. Subsequent use has not been convincing, though.

With 748 it has been a little better, although still not ideal by any stretch. I chose this because I tried the long 225 Nosler Ball Tip, and managed to get it seated, around 2.8" or so, and it worked. Nosler data is pretty mild on this cartridge, if memory serves around 48.0g or so, and with a magnum primer the first group of five was really very good. Right after that, accuracy went south, and didn't get any better when I switched to some of my old stand by loads. I beleive that it had to do with more progressive fouling, but it could have just been me. The same load with 225 Partition was no good at all, pretty much from the start.

Back to drawing board, and saw that Speer lists its 220g Flat head with 748, magnum primer, 52.0 grains (from memory, might not be exact) as max. A + 4 swing scared me a little, so I went 51.0 grains, and these just shot okay- acceptable, but certainly nothing to dance about.

The next attempt to get a 225 was the Sierra with 4320, to Sierra max, and that shot really well, reckon just at 0.9 in- but the primer was slightly cratered, not to the degree of any real issue, likely, but enough that I got nervous- so I put the gun on the bench for the season and the rest of the year.

The 225 bullet and the 358 just seem to me to be peas and carrots, but at 0 for 4 at this point, further development was postponed. I did have a good load a few years back with 3031 and the Sierra, and I'll have to get re-aquainted with this load I reckon. I can't wait to hear how the TSX works out.

I have no trouble with 200 grainers at all, the Hornady Spit doing beautifully with 48.5 g of IMR 4064. This is my sanity load, the one that I shoot when I am trying to figure out if it is the load or me. The 200g Horn bullet has been the most accuratte in both the 358 and 350 Rem Mag, and I'll looking forward to see how it does in the Ruger.

Download your target from the leverguns forum, and then send them to RD after you shoot them up. I think its open now and runs until Sept, so its at your leisure. As we are going to practice with these guns for hunting season anyway, might as well save the good groups on the RD target to try to salvage the good name of Browning. I'm going to shoot this gun at the 50 yard match, at least early, and then see how my old scoped 99 does at the 100 before I decide to put glass on the gun or not and shoot the 100 yard match.

Good luck fellows.

Steve

I don't know if this is of any help, but when I run into severely compressed loads. I hold the charged shell against my vibratory case cleaner. It settles the powder quickly.

If you got any Hodgdon's Ball-C2 try it instead of W-748, also try W-760 or H-414 (virtually same stuff), if you want to burn a ball powder in that cartridge. Use Winchester Magnum primers or the Federal 215 (if you can find them). BLC-2 usually worked really well for me in similar sized cartridges used in 10" factory and 15" unlimited silhouette pistols. Great consistency and velocity, but the muzzle blast in those short barrels would break windows two miles away and bounce the gravel off the roof of the firing line! :D

I used Barnes X bullets in my .35-348 Ackley Improved bolt action rifle, where case capacity isn't a problem, but at the time these bullets weren't very consistent. The cannelure wasn't always in the same place. They never shot very well, nor did the X-Bullet in the .348 Winchester. I haven't tried the TSX in anything but the 7mm Magnum, it has promise, but I'm moly coating them before going further. These bullets require a barrel completely clean of previous fouling before use. If your barrel is rough, i.e. not hand lapped, they will copper foul quickly, especially if there is gliding metal fouling from jacketed bullets still in the bore, leaving a mess that opens groups. These bullets are great for their performance on game, and they are lead free, but they need a little different handling and technique. They should produce great accuracy being monolithic, and my early 7mm Mag results show this. I really like the Barnes product line, using a lot of their varmint bullets, so don't think I'm bad mouthing them, it's just that any revolutionary product requires a learning curve. In fact, I can wait to try their new "Varmint Grenade" bullets! SPLAT! ;)

I just jumped on the .358 225 TSX (350 RM) band wagon, I to have to seat the bullet out with a "ring" showing, but I also have a modified magazine that allows me to do so 2.930 COL. I have only shot three rounds 46,47,48gr of REL. 7. I cleaned the bore really well with the barned bore cleaner. Here is the result of those three rounds
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d40/63deuce100/OUTDOOR%20ACTIVITIES/IMG_0014_1.jpg
This shows a lot of potential for the bullet, at least in this rifle. This pic does not show too well but you may be able to see the exposed ring.
http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d40/63deuce100/OUTDOOR%20ACTIVITIES/IMG_0013_1.jpg
I'd say try a different powder, and maybe resell the unused bullets and go with the 200gr TSX? Hope all workes out with your load.

If you get time try he H4895 it takes less space than Varget and burns faster than IMR4895. For the 358win it gives higher velocities in my 20.5" barrel than hornady lists in their manuals. 46.0grs @ 2450, and 47.5grs @2527fps, for the 200ge spirepoint. The 225 partition and 46.5grs @ 2430fps worked well.
Hornady shows H4895 doing better than reloader #15 for the 35whelen and since its the powder for my 35rem 200gr loads I think I havs found a graet powder. But like most I like to hear more data to support it.

If I hadn't already shelled out about $85 for 100 of these 225 gr TSX bullets I might be inclined to try the 200 gr TSX. Probably could sell the 225's for the same outlay but would rather try them if I can get them to work. The suggestion of using H4895 is a good one. I can always use the IMR powder in another load.

Tjen, where did you find the load data for H4895 and the 225gr TSX in 358 Win? Hornady? I have had a hard time finding much on this combo and only have what Barnes sent me last year.

BTW, Barnes never did respond to my questions about the data I got from them. I may try calling them yet but am less than impressed by the customer service so far. Considering how much I've got tied up in bullets you would think they'd want me to buy more in the future. I will give them ONE chance via the telephone. If that fails I will be a former customer. Customer service is almost a thing of the past when it comes to most products these days. I will allow that a goodly number of manufacturers for our hobby give outstanding customer service. So I won't write them off just yet.

More as I know it...

Thanks for all the information guys.

If I hadn't already shelled out about $85 for 100 of these 225 gr TSX bullets I might be inclined to try the 200 gr TSX. Probably could sell the 225's for the same outlay but would rather try them if I can get them to work. The suggestion of using H4895 is a good one. I can always use the IMR powder in another load.

Tjen, where did you find the load data for H4895 and the 225gr TSX in 358 Win? Hornady? I have had a hard time finding much on this combo and only have what Barnes sent me last year.

BTW, Barnes never did respond to my questions about the data I got from them. I may try calling them yet but am less than impressed by the customer service so far. Considering how much I've got tied up in bullets you would think they'd want me to buy more in the future. I will give them ONE chance via the telephone. If that fails I will be a former customer. Customer service is almost a thing of the past when it comes to most products these days. I will allow that a goodly number of manufacturers for our hobby give outstanding customer service. So I won't write them off just yet.

More as I know it...

Thanks for all the information guys.
Thats funny I have had REAL good luck with Barns on the phone and via E mail, If you have to talk to them ask for Ty Herring I have dealt with him on both the e mail and on the phone, real nice guy.
BT

Don't rely on email. There are probably spam filters on both ends, and some in the middle. If their email address has been posted anywhere publicly, they are up to their ears in spam - I promise.

Unfortunate, but that's the age we live in. Full of modern conveniences that aggravate the #@$%^ out of us :p

Don't rely on email. There are probably spam filters on both ends, and some in the middle. If their email address has been posted anywhere publicly, they are up to their ears in spam - I promise.

Unfortunate, but that's the age we live in. Full of modern conveniences that aggravate the #@$%^ out of us :p

I agree...that's why I said I would wait until I can talk to them on the phone before passing final judgement.

I just got off the phone with Ty at Barnes (800-574-9200). He was very helpful and set my mind at ease regarding safety issues. However, the problem I have is obviously a real one. He didn't think that H4895 would make much difference. I can't say since I've never used that powder nor compared it to IMR4895. The latter powder is recommended by Barnes for this cartridge/bullet combination so I plan to continue trying. He also recommended a longer drop tube and dies that don't reduce size as much. I don't currently have the long drop tube but had some success using the "tapping method for powder settling". The cases I used had been sized using my Hornady dies instead of the Lees, so I will start a new batch using only the Lees since they may not reduce size as much (but could reduce more!). Other Barnes recommended loads:

IMR3031 41.0 - 45.0gr 2281 - 2504 fps
H4198 37.0 - 41.0gr 2251 - 2492 fps

Velocities out of a 24" barrel. *** Use this load data at your own risk. If in doubt call Barnes yourself ***

Also of interest:
The 200 TSX requires a minimum of 1800 fps for expansion.
The 225 TSX requires a minimum of 1600 fps for expansion.

Well, another year has gone by and I just got back to this problem. By now I have a longer (6") drop tube but this makes no discernible difference. I tried that on Monday. Today I took another approach.

I chose some fired cases that have enough neck tension to hold one of these bullets pretty good. I seated one way out and chambered it. This was repeated a number of times and each time I came up with 2.9" OAL to engage the rifling. Then I decreased the OAL until the round would feed from the magazine. This yielded 2.8" OAL. I built 5 such rounds and ran them repeatedly through the action, feeding from the magazine.

So it appears that I can get away with a 2.8" OAL which may be enough to seat all charges up to the max I'm looking to reach. With a little work I believe the magazine could be modified to allow an even longer OAL but don't want to end up buying a new magazine if/when I go too far.

Another thing that I find odd is that if my measurements are correct then I have about 0.100" of bullet jump/freebore in this rifle when seated this way with this particular bullet, and even more if held to the recommended max OAL. I wonder what that does to accuracy? Anyone else tried this measurement in a 358 BLR before? The ogive on these bullets has a large radius so the bullet has a long gentle taper. That probably goes a long way to explaining how these lengths are so different.

Another observation about the TSX is that due to the hardness and number/location of grooves a Lee Factory Crimp Die doesn't work very well. In fact getting any crimp if the OAL positioned a groove overlapping the case mouth would be nearly impossible.

I really want to use this rifle for elk in Oct. Hopefully I'll get time to finish working up these loads. Got layed off last week so have plenty of time on my hands but not so much money to spend. Making these work just got more important.

You may want to give Ramshot's TAC powder a try. I've used it in my 350 Rem mag and it gave excellent velocity w/out having to cram the case full. It's a fast burning, double base powder that is also excellent for the 308 and 358.

The info below came from Ramshot for the 358 Win. THis is not specific to the TSX, so be careful. I haven't tried it in my 358, but will soon. I got some 200 grainers just for the 358, but now am thinking of staying w/ the 225's I use in my 350 Rem mag as they hold downrange velocity better.

Let us know if you give TAC a try.


Caliber: .358 Winchester.
Barrel length: 24”
Powder: Ramshot – TAC.
Bullet weight: 180 grains.
Start load: 48.0grains (2300 – 2400 Ft/p/sec)
Maximum load: 53.0grains (2400 – 2500 Ft/p/sec). Full case/Compressed.
Bullet weight: 200 grains.
Start load: 43.0grains (2300 – 2400 Ft/p/sec)
Maximum load: 48.0grains (2500 – 2600 Ft/p/sec). Full case/Compressed.
Bullet weight: 225 grains.
Start load: 41.0grains (2200 – 2300 Ft/p/sec)
Maximum load: 46.0grains (2400 – 2500 Ft/p/sec). Full case/Compressed.

I appear to have run into a wall with this project. Using the 2.8 OAL determined earlier, I loaded some rounds at 49.0, 50.0 and 51.0 gr. In one instance I was unable to make the bullet stay put and it was consistently pushed back out of the case. When I test fired these I found that there were chambering problems occasionally. It took a little force to make the cartridges chamber. While firing the 50.0 gr samples one wouldn't chamber at all. On closer observation I found that all of the remaining, unfired rounds were badly bulged just below the shoulder. So it appears that the case is just too full. Velocity for the 49.0 gr loads was averaging around 2400 fps out of my 20" barreled BLR. One of the 50.0 gr loads ran 2495 fps. Even without the bulged case problem this velocity may (or may not) be too high. It's hard to tell since I can find no reliable data for this combination of components. Barnes claims that you might get 50-150 fps greater velocity out of the TSX vs the standard X bullet, at the same pressures. Their data was from a 24 inch barrel.

I don't think I have any choice, safety-wise, but to move to another powder. TAC looks to hold some promise and the 3031 data I got from Barnes might work well too. I hate spending the money on another cannister of powder right now but at the same time I've got a bunch invested in the bullets already. I really want to make these bullets work.

TAC has worked well for me in a 35 Rem and I'm still working with it in a 223 Rem. In a recent Handloader issue, John Barsness worked some loads with the 358 Win using TAC. With a 200 grn TSX he had a max charge of 52.0 giving a velocity of 2749 fps. He didn't use a 225 TSX but used the 225 Sierra with a max of 49.0 grns giving 2552 fps. His max using 250 grn bullets was 48.0 grns. This was using mag primers and a Ruger Hawkeye so keep in mind he was using a bolt gun. Hopefully that's a starting point for you to develop a load.

Here's what Western Powder had to say about using TAC in the 358 Win:

TAC will be too slow burning for the limited case capacity.
Barnes actually did test our faster burning X-Terminator Barnes load guide nr 4 page 319.
Their suggested loads are between “START” 39.5grains(2072Fps) to Maximum of 44.5grains (2315Fps) Max load will be a compressed load.

Regards
Johan Loubser
Ballistician
Ramshot/Accurate Powders
Tel: (406) 234 04 22 email:johan@ramshot.com
Western Powders Inc --MilesCity – Montana.


I don't have this loading guide so don't know the particulars of barrel length, etc.

I've run out of time on this project again (my season starts in 2 weeks) so will have to fall back to using my 300 RSAUM. In the model 7 magnum this is a decent round and makes a really good deep woods/open terrain hunting rifle.

That's a little odd. Ramshot told me:

"Date: Monday, July 21, 2008, 12:43 PM

Yes it will work fine in the .358Win and 35Whelen however, it a tad too slow in the 356Win and our X-terminator will work best."

I've just loaded some 180 and 200 grainers up to chrono in my 358. Will report later today.

Here's my data. SHooting a Remington 760, 358 Win w/a 22" barrel:

180 grain SPeer JSP, 51.0 gr TAC = 2710 fps
200 grain Rem JSP, 46.0 gr TAC = 2420 fps

Recoil was very mild. May up that 200 gr load for the Barnes TSX. I think that 180 will be great deer round.

My 3031/H322 loads fly a good bit faster than published data from my 22" Ruger Hawkeye in .358.

I had a 200 grain load made with 3031 that I chonoed in the mid 27xx's and showed zero signs of high pressure. The loads i've made with that same bullet and a little less H322 have chronoed mid 26xx's.

I stopped and considered both of these loads max just because of the high velocity attained. Basically if I can get 2600/2700 muzzle velocity with a 200 grain bullet, that's better than .30-06 ballistics and all I can ask from this little case. :)

My 3031/H322 loads fly a good bit faster than published data from my 22" Ruger Hawkeye in .358.

I had a 200 grain load made with 3031 that I chonoed in the mid 27xx's and showed zero signs of high pressure. The loads i've made with that same bullet and a little less H322 have chronoed mid 26xx's.

I stopped and considered both of these loads max just because of the high velocity attained. Basically if I can get 2600/2700 muzzle velocity with a 200 grain bullet, that's better than .30-06 ballistics and all I can ask from this little case. :) .

Here's a load that I have been using in my BLR'81 / .358 Winchester since 1985:

200gr Hornady PSP, CCI-250 Mag Rifle Primer - 49.0C IMR3031 compressed, OAL 2.80", no crimp. 2617 FPS - 3042 FT.LBS. 3-shot groups - 1 1/4", + - 1/4".

With scope mounted 1.5" above bore and zeroed at 200 yards:

Muzzle: +1.50" 2617 fps 3042 ft.lbs, 0.0" wind drift w10mph cross.
50 yds: +1.24" 2457 fps 2680 ft.lbs, 0.3" wind drift w/10mph cross.
100 yds: +2.54" 2303 fps 2356 ft.lbs, 1.3" wind drift w/10mph cross.
150 yds: +2.20" 2157 fps 2066 ft.lbs, 3.1" wind drift w/10mph cross.
200 yds: ZERO, 2017 fps 1806 ft.lbs, 5.6" wind drift w/10mph cross.
250 yds. -4.36" 1884 fps 1575 ft.lbs, 9.1" wind drift w/10mph cross.
300 yds. -11.14" 1757 fps 1371 ft.lbs, 13.5" wind drift w/10mph cross.
350 yds. -20.76" 1638 fps 1191 ft.lbs, 19.0" wind drift w/10mph cross.
400 yds. -33.64" 1527 fps 1036 ft.lbs, 25.6" wind drift w/10mph cross.

BMasterson

Out of curiousity, how are you crimping the bullets? With 150gr TSX's in my .308 Win BLR I crimp them into the final groove with a Lee Factory crimper and they are just as slick as can be. Mind you, my load of H4895 isn't trying to wring the last fps out of the cartridge and the load.

I ran the numbers for the Barnes 225gr TSX at 2,500 and 2,400 fps through a ballistic program, each with a 3 inch high at 100 yard zero. The faster load reaches the minimum effective terminal velocity (1,600 fps) at 490 yds while the slower load maxes out at about 440yds - net loss of 50 yards. Big deal.

Trajectory at the max range (by terminal velocity) is -55.7" for the faster at 490 yds vs -44.7 for the slower at 440yds. However, if you want to compare the trajectory at a given distance, let's say 400yds, the faster load is -28.9 and the slower is -32.6 (about a minute of angle). Difference in wind deflection is less than 0.2 moa at 400yds.

All that to say, be happy with 2,400fps and trust the TSX to penetrate anything you'll shoot at in North America from end to end from the muzzle to as far away as you can hit it.