I've heard these terms used time and again over the years so folks can anyone out there tell me when and where they personally witnessed this dreaded action. I'm betting that no one had ever seen this live except on a special effects lot for the movies. So far after 40 years of shooting bp revolvers, I have not seen it so is this one of those Old Wives Tails? Come on lets prove this problem or put it to rest perminitely!

I experienced this twice as a young man shooting a Navy Arms Model 60 is .44 cal. In the 1960’s we used any lead we could find and I was using hard lead and Aeroshell No. 5 – a long fiber wheel bearing grease – for lubricant. We were shooting in New Mexico and in the heat of summer Crisco would not stay in place and was pretty messy. I ran out of grease and began shooting with no lubricant over the seated ball. I was using water from a canteen to clean between cylinders. I had two chain fires, one involving the cylinder I fired and one additional and the next involving two other chambers. The report was slightly louder and the fire from the cylinders was quite visible. Other than that all seemed well. The cylinders that fired were to each side of the barrel and the bullets did not touch the wedge. So, it can happen and did happen to me.
I believe you could easily duplicate this by casting bullets from wheel weight or harder alloy and not using grease on the seated bullets.

Likewise, had it happen on a hot day. The lube did not stay in the cylinder. Five chambers fired. Lots of noise and smoke, no damage. It was a replica Colt Walker.

I'm wondering, did the cylinders that fire have caps on their nipples? Were the caps tight? I'm trying to figure out the physics of this one. How did the "fire" reach the powder? A flash past 1/4" of lead and lube or a flash through the nipple? Any ideas?

Good point. Believe that a BP revolver can chain fire from either end.

From the front, what lube you have may not last past the first two or three shots...depends on how easily it melts, but the cylinder gap flash tends to not only melt it, but to blow the melt away. Load up a cylinder, fire three rounds, then inspect the results. Loosely fitting ball, esp. one cast that may not be truely round, can certain;ly help a front-end chain fire.

From the nipple end, it's not too uncommon for caps to fall off or fit loosely, and i can understand how the flash from one cylinder firing could fine it's way either into an open nipple, or into a loose cap and set it off. Sometimes what is called a chain fire isn't...a loose nipple and a cylinder with a bit of end shake can set off a cap by slamming it into the recoil shield...looks like a chain fire, but isn't.

Solution to the front end seems to be to use ball large enough to cut a ring of lead when seated...use truely round ball...use lube that won't melt all that easily...and/or use BOTH a wad under the ball AND lube over the ball.

On the nipple end, using correctly fitted caps and replacing worn nipples (or even new ones with too large a vent hole) seem to prevent chain fires from that end.
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Yes...I've had one accidental cain fire and have abused an old 1858 repro. to produce them. Not all that easy to make happen on demand, but can certainly increase the odds of them happening.

Never thought about the caps causing it. In my case it was probably my inexperience with good loading procedures.

this might be worth a read:
http://www.svartkrutt.net/articles/vis.php?id=13

I had two of the Navy Arms Model 60’s, still have one. They were pretty high quality revolvers despite the brass frame. I never had any trouble when using any type of lube on the front of the seated bullets. In the 1960’s we had a smaller selection of percussion caps and I used any brand I could get, some fit better than others. I tried squeezing the caps on the nipples and seating them on the nipples using the eraser end of a lead pencil and it was still common for purcusion caps to fall off the nipples and tie up the cylinder.
Even though Crisco is blown away from the front of the cylinder I have never experienced a chain fire when some type of lube was used on the front of the cylinder.
I have used quite a bit of rather hard lead in cap and ball revolvers when cast both as round balls and as conical balls (these from the old Dixie molds) and this of course means smaller diameter bullets, the only trouble I experienced was the one time I ran out of lubricant.

ribbonstone (YOU HIT THE NAIL ON THE HEAD)on my 58 I shoot 200gr conical 30 grs 3f things move I have seen that just lucky so far!! Good fitting caps tight balls 20grs powder you won't have that problem.

The one and only time I fired my Remington without lube over the balls, multiple cylinders went off. It's been a long time ago but I believe it was both chambers next to the one being fired.

I guess this summer I will try to produce a chain fire. But in the meantime I have always used a lubed wad between my powder and my bullets with a thicker grease over the ball. I always figured the grease was to lube the bore as the bullet traveled down the barrel. I've always used tight caps, and I've always pressed them on with a wooden dowel. I don't think I have to worry about that end. Like I said earlier, I've been shooting cap n ball revolvers now for over 40 years without a chain fire and I've always loaded this way so maybe I've been doing something right after all.

Thankfully I've never experienced a chain fire either but after reading about one years ago that was attributed to the nipple end, I put o-rings on the nipples so when the cap is seated, the cup end is fitted against the o-ring. The o-rings hold up well but carry spares anyway, adjust as necessary while loading to ensure they are in contact with the cap ... not fool-proof solution but it's an added level of safety.

You'll find that most chain fires, and there are lots of them every year, are with the cheap replica's. With lower cost comes lower quality meaning that from one cylinder to the next and one nipple to the next will be considerably wide tolerances. As others stated, chain fires can happen from both ends of the cylinder. Now, before anyone jumps on me about comparing a four figure high quality replica to the el cheapo specials....I've had several el cheapo's over the years from various mfg's - all of them had their faults and shortcomings, some were just pure junk.

Nonetheless, the first order of business is inspecting the gun completely BEFORE you do anything else. It has to be constructed of sound materials and assembled correctly - I did get one brand new in the box with a casting flaw in the brass frame that would have likely causes a catastrophic failure with the first shot fired and no, it wasn't visible until the hammer was removed from the frame. Cylinder must be in dead-on alignment with the bore, this isn't always the case and even some of the better quality el cheapo's can need considerable timing work. Another did not have the hammer fit correctly to the cylinder so it would not engage the safety notches nor would it provide an un-interrupted contact with the nipple face. Nipples & cylinders also need to be measured accurately, one particular 1860 army I got had one chamber that was egged to the point where it left a considerable gap on either side of the ball.

Test fit everything before you load any powder too. Check to make sure the balls will correctly fit the chambers - drive them back out from the nipple end with a brass punch or pull 'em from the front with a ball puller. Check the nipples too, not only ensure they all have the same diameter flash holes but also to ensure the flash holes are not too big - while you're there, you need to check the outside profile and diameter of the nipples as well. As others said, be sure the caps fit snug to the nipples without having to crimp them, if you need to crimp them you're leaving gaps on two sides that a spark can get into.

I use an over powder wad cut from pressed paper (milk carton / shoe box type material). Load the powder, insert the wad about 0.125" into the chamber, use a heavy duty industrial applicator syringe to squirt a dollop (about 0.130" - 0.180" diameter for a .44 cal) of strait crisco or other soft BP lube, then load the ball as normal and cap the ball off with finger-applied lube. Caution- if you put too much lube under the ball, it won't seat properly, be prepared to pull the ball if necessary.

I might suggest a little something I learned along the way on ML, both rifles and handguns. The weather here in Florida can be very damp in the swamps and hammocks we hunt in. There are some small plastic tubes on the market that are designed to slip over the cap and down on the nipples. I use them on both my TC side hammer rifle and Ruger Old Army. They keep both the damp out and reduce the side flame on the outside of the nipple. They are easy to flip off, after the gun is fired, with your fingernail. A loaded c&b handgun, along with Bore Butter in the front of each cylinder, can be left loaded for days and still fire.
Just some thoughts....Regards, James

I am conducting an ongoing experiment with my bp revolver in that I reloaded the 6 chambers of a cylinder 3 years ago. I swipped the sides of the nipples with lube before placing the cap on them. Every 6 months I have goine out and fired one cylinder. So far each cylinder has fired when I pulled the trigger. One cylinder left for new years. dry mountain air seems to be ineffective as a contaminent.

Wet swamp air isn't.

Use to seal the nipple with a little ring of bees wax, softened and rolled by hand. Worked well even in the rain.

Wife got one of these feet-wax things, that runs with a soy wax. Make soy wax candles as well. Stuff melts at low temperatures, low enough that even molten it won't burn you when you dip your finger into it. That works pretty well as a sealant.

The only BP revolver I own currently was bought to keep me from going stir crazy while unemployed, semi-homeless, after Katrina. No name anywhere on it, no serial number, no proof marks, brass framed 36 Navy that was bought broken/dissassembled/ in a paper bag (for $10...and I proably should have offered $5). Probably assembled from a kit in the 1960's.

Keep me entertained for quite awhile, making a new three-fingered spring (from a street sweeper bush steel brissle stuck in a curb), refitting the things that never got fitted, hacksawing/filing/stoning a replacement wedge from a bit of scrap steel, and replacing the nipples. Had no choice in that, had to buy new nipples.

The old nipples were nearly straight tubes, very much over sized inside. While I never fired that pistol with those nipples installed, believe they would help cause a chain fire though the back end. Wouldn't take much to jar a cap loose...and once loose, all that extra flame jetting out an over sized nipple is going to find his neighbor sooner or later.
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That brass 36 turned out to be a good shooter. Not opposed to brass farmed 36's...the CSA had quite a few brass 36's (but no brass 44's I can uncover) and a36 doesn't seem to stress the brass frame as much as the 44's.

As I get the urge, may put those oversized nipples back in and try to cause a chain fire...but with corn meal as the "bullet".

Let me add another quick question. I was just going to ask this same question though it's always been my habit to use front end lube. I figure the "old timers" didn't lube the front and relied on tight bullets or luck.
My question to those of you who have experienced multi cylinders going off - How did you not have major damage? Looking at my revolvers cylinders, if any other cylinder fired the bullet would have to hit some part of the frame. I can't believe the pressure is reduced enough not being in the barrel to be semi-benign. What physically happened? Though I think front end lube is a good idea I'd like to know when this idea started. It seems more like a 20th century "be safe" invention than a 19th century necessity.

I have examined some original loaded pistols and saw no lube on the front of the cylinder, but that does not mean it was not used.
Sometimes I think the chain fire problem can about with modern shooters playing with old originals that were about worn out?....maybe not!
I think most chain fires come from the back in of the cylinder instead of the front end. Some handgun designs handle fire around the nipples better that others.
However, to be on the safe side....use an Ox-Yoke under the ball, lube on front, and maybe even the plastic tubes down on the capped nipple. Loaded this way there is little chance and also helpd keep the damp out.
Regards, James

Lubing the front of the cylinder is far from a new idea. You can purchase copies of “Instructions for loading the Colt’s Revolver” from Dixie Gun Works – Pioneer Press and the military instruction manual for the 1860 revolver. I believe both make mention of lubricant on the front of the cylinder. I could be wrong on this and it may be in other writing, it has been awhile since I did any serious study of the cp and ball revolver.
Saterlee’s 10 Old Gun Catalogs shows examples of grease boxes made from tin, horn and ivory. I believe there were boxes made from India rubber also.
H.M. Clines The Muzzle Loader Then and Now is another good reference and a good read in general on the making and using of muzzle loading rifles with some information on pistols.
Using combustible cartridges changes everything. The conical ball carries a small amount of lubricant. I have made combustible cartridges using salt peter and various types of paper using both round balls and conical balls but most all of the original combustible cartridges I have seen were laded with conical balls.
I was surprised there was no damage from the two side cylinders firing. I thought the balls would have touched the wedge but they did not. The flame from the cylinder did not indicate to me there was much in the way of reduced force.

Very interseting and informative, to say the least! We need more of this insight! I would suppose that most pistol ammo issused during the period were made up into paper/powder cartridge. However, I wonder if the lube was designed to reduce chain fires?.....or was an early attempt to give lube to the bullet? But, that does no hold much water, as most of the lube over the balls in the cylinder is blown off upon first firing. Wads under the ball/bullet is not new. Many British cap and ball revolvers have molds that has a stem cast on the bullet for wads to be attached. This again seeems aimed at sealing the chamber or bore? It's an interesting subject though.
Regards, james

My only experience with a chain fire was my first time ever shooting a cap and ball revolver. That is, as in The First Shot I ever fired. The gun was a 58 remington. The 2 chambers to the left went off also. The owner said it never did that before and he has had the gun for years. The gun wasn't maintained well and didn't have grease at the front. The gun wasn't damaged, but the tree next to me was. Did this scare me away from black powder revolvers? Nope, I went right out and bought one and now I want another.

I have always believed the multiple firings are from the rear, never the front, grease or not. One of the main reasons is that those replica nipples have too large a hole in them. Changing to good modern nipples will solve it. Old timers would have it happen when nipples burned out because of the poor steel.
I had it happen once with an Italian Colt 1860. All it did was leave a smear on the barrel key. I found the holes in the nipples were double the safe size. There was as much flame coming out of the rear as from the front. It was enough to dislodge the next cap.
I know a lot of you shooting some of those replica percussion rifles have had the hammer go to full cock when shot, same deal.
I have not even touched on over long nipples from some of the foreign makers.

I agree with your analysis. I still have the original nipples on my 1851 Navy made by Centenial Arms that I purchased way back in 1968. They have slowly eroaded until the flash hole is about 1/32 in diameter. Because of that I have always made sure that the caps fit very snuggly. To do that, after several years of the hammer flattening the old nipple, I used a metal lathe to turn the outside down on each nipple so that #10 caps fit so snuggly that I have to use the edge of my knife to remove them it they don't split when fired.

I believe an overloaded chamber plus a loose cap falling off on the recoil would cause a chain fire as the spurt of flame bounces off the shield into that open nipple. That is the only way, in my opinion, I can see a chain fire ocurring in today's bp revolvers. Just my opinion.

I've had 2 chainfires in my ROAs,(just one additional cylinder fired, not all of them). Both were caused by poor fit of the caps. (using #11 instead of #10). I know this because the front of the cylinder was sealed well with Borebutter, and it was cool outside.

As an aftre-thought....some years back, I bought a pack of small plastic tubes that were pushed down over the nipples with the cap on. The tubes left the top of the cap exposed and with down on the nipple beyond the bottom of the cap. I use them on my rifle and Ruger Old Army. After firing the gun, use fingernail to flip of the fired cap in the plastic tube. I use them due to the damp air here in Florida swamps....but there is no way for flame to get to the csp from another cap going off.
I don't know who made them and iI am looking for more now.
Regards, James

I did some research and found that CVA makes a Weather Protector Set for caps for both revolvers and rifles/shotguns. Look for Item #AC1527. It had 22 cap grippers that should water proof and protect your revolver from chain fires from the cap/nipple end of the cylinder. Heck, I didn't know that these things were available. I believe it just might prevent any future chain fires from loose caps. Just my opinion.

OK.....I followed up on those little plastic tubes that slide down over the cap, leaving the top of the cap exposed, and down on the nipple below the cap. I find they are call Cap Grippers. I called Dave at CVA and he gave me the phone for Deer Creek (765-525-6181) and they have them. I oredered out some more as I am running out. These are the best little gimmicks I have found for keeping the cap dry in damp weather and stops the caps from fragging. I use them all the time on my rifle and Ruger Old Army!
Regards, James

I was shooting an old original 1860 Army one day. I had loaded and shot each chamber separately and then loaded the entire cylinder. I had a light load of 15 grns Goex 3F, cornmeal, a wad, roundball, and covered w/water pump grease. On my first shot I had a 4-chamber chain fire. I am convinced that there was enough play in the cylinder that it set back and set off the other caps. I don't shoot the old girl anymore--bought a reproduction and have'nt had a problem w/it.

Salt--- You make a good point. I like authentic stuff more than most people... However there often are reliability / problem issues where the modern reproductions do NOT have the vast array of problems that real, older guns often DO have. Plus, like with the reproductions (ie the Lyman Trade Rifle) the barrel pops off so easily for cleaning. I know no original old gun would disassemble for cleaning as easily as this. What I have done to "get around the biggest drawback to reproductions" that I see is---I strip them down and refinish them with Alkanet Root (red stain used by the old gun makers) and Black stain, then apply about 20 hand rubbed coats of linseed oil alternated with coats of TUNG OIL, using the last 4 or 5 coats as high gloss TUNG OIL only for the added protection I have noticed with TUNG over Linseed. I then use pumice and rottenstone, hand rubbed again, to get the desired sheen. These guns look terrific and yes authentic when I finish with them. So I get a look and finish like that of the old guns but with the advantages of reliability and superior features of the modern reproductions... the other advantage of the reproductions is the modern proof testing, thus the ability to load these babies up to high powered hunting loads. Quite frankly I had some old doubles that would loosen up with any modern load levels. So, I could only use low powered loads... Geez, that is like half a gun.

I would disagree that "the CAS had quite a few brass framed revolvers", I'd say it was more like "a very few". They just were never able to produce any significant number of them during the war. It seems that by the time they could get a plant set up and running, the war would have moved and the plant was in danger so had to be dismantled and relocated. Original confederate revolvers, brass or iron, are very rare. Plus, they weren't even brass, they were bronze.
But as to chainfires, I've never experienced nor seen one but they do happen. I've never seen a modern gun blown up but that happens too.

There are a number of references in Civil War literature to chain fires in Colt's Revolving Rifles. Not handguns, I realize, but the mechanism is similar.
I believe the issued cartridges for use in the Colt's were a conical bullet in a paper cartridge holding bullet and powder. I've never seen a mention of grease being used.
I'm sure that, in combat, reloading was done as rapidly as possible, and putting grease/lubricant in the front of the cylinder (assuming grease or lubricant was available) wasn't bothered with.
Being a rifle, where someone would have one hand ahead of the cylinder, a chain fire would be a serious problem. At least one unit was told to lower the loading lever and use that as a forward grip (I've no idea how well that would work) to get their hand out of the way of chainfires.

Careful handling loaded revolver cylinders. I remember reading about a guy dropping one and dying from the gunshot wound from a single chamber. Don't underestimate the energy a bullet has when it leaves the chamber mouth. I can't cite a source for that one and can't remember whether it was with a cartridge or cap and ball revolver, but I suspect it was cap and ball.