I have a 45-70 1895GS that I cast RCBS 400gr GC bullets for, and was thinking of getting a 300gr or so mould for deer hunting and pushing it hard (200-2100 fps) to get flattest trajectory. I got a spike this year with 400 gr bullet, but the small deer around East Tennessee don't need this much medicine, and the 1600fps must be lobbed high with great range estimation at 125yd+. I know I need a gas check, as I already perform this operation with my 400gr bullet, but I was wondering if there was a quicker way to lube and gas check them than a lubrisizer (sorry, this rules out paper patching). My .459 size die barely touches the edges as I size, so sizing is not the real purpose here, just lube and gas check seating. I am all about going to Lee Liquid Alox solely, as I have heard many good things about it and I already use stick alox, but how do you affix the gas checks. I am thinking about getting a Ranch Dog 350gr mold (great price, quick heat up, great price, double or 6-cavity, great price, wide meplat-gas check design, great price, etc) and had seen the Lee .460 Lube and size kit, but have no experience with these; are they any good and/or fast?

Any good, hot cast loads in this weight range? RX-7 pref, may buy some H4198 or H322 if needed.
All input will be appreciated.

(Sorry 'bout length of post, didn't mean to write a novel)

All that I can offer is very limited experience with Lee liquid alox in a rifle barrel. I get some leading near the muzzle with my Winchester 94 30-30 at near 1600fps. Is not a big problem, but it is there. My "thinking" at this point is that it does NOT last to the end of the tube with what I'm trying to do. That is a work in progress.
I enjoy the stuff in revolvers. Works well and is easy for a newbie caster.

Good luck and nice to meet ya,

Cheezywan

I use the liquid Alox with paper patched bullets in my 30/30,and have no problems
I use the cake Alox mix in my lubsizer for other castbullets,with no problems.
I don't know any easier way to apply gas checks then with the lubsizer.I abandoned the long used pan method as soon as I got it.
Frank

I use a lee sizer in .460 to crimp gas checks, been working fine.

The Lee sizer as bsn says is designed to put gas checks on. It's inexpensive and does a great job and you can get it in most sizes as needed. It goes on your press and is a push thru design so you do not need any nose punches to match any certain bullet design.

How do you load it and how does it apply the lube? Sounds like it's easier than the old Saeco lubrisizer that my dad has, and a lot less messy?

The Lee Sizer is like a die that you screw into your press. You get a ram that goes in the press ram that pushes the bullets nose first thru the die into a container that come with the sizer die as the storage case. Pushing against the base means you don't need a nose punch to push the bullet back out of the sizer like the Lyman or RCBS's.

The liquid Alox system Lee designed uses his bullet liquid alox lube. It's applied by "tumble lubing". You put a couple or three dozen bullets in a cottage cheese container and dribble a few drops of the liquid alox on them then just swirl around til the bullets are coated. It doesn't take much. You then set them up on a piece of tinfoil or wax paper and let them dry overnight. At that point if they need sized or need gas checks I run them thru the sizer which attaches the gas checks. I will then tumble lube again to get a good coat on them and let dry over night.

You can run them thru the sizer without tumble lubing to attach the gas checks, but they seem to go so much easier if their lubed before. I use a really light coat both times. It just doesn't take much, actually way less than you think is needed. This system puts the lube on the outside of the bullets where it's most effective. Lee says you can heat the bullet with a torch and it won't seperate from the lead even as it melts.

I used a lubra-sizer for years and Lee's system is so much easier and so much less expensive both in lube and for the equipment. I haven't had any leading problems and can't tell any difference in the way the bullets shoot.

I now shoot several Lee bullets that are designed just for tumble lubing and don't require a sizer. They can be shot as cast with great results. Anyway not putting down the lubri-sizer systems, they do a good job, but I like the ease of the Lee system.

Here's where you can look at the sizing equipment and the liquid alox.

http://www.leeprecision.com/cgi/catalog/browse.cgi?1116728482.5129=/html/catalog/lubesize.html

+1 on using less Alox than you think you need. When seating gas checks I thin the Alox 50/50 with mineral spirits tumble them and let them dry overnight. Then I seat the gas checks and give them a thin coat of unthinned Lee Alox. If you do this in large batches it goes fairly quickly.

Anyone have any experience or recomendations with Ranch Dog Molds? Loads for 300-350gr and Reloder 7(2000fps+)? Is Lee Liquid Alox good for these speeds?

I have one of his 350 and 425 gr molds never had a problem with leading, I will try and look up my RL7 loads for you.

Thanks for the info, y'all! The Lee system sounds like the ticket. Ranch Dog sells the .460, so I'll probably order it when I get my mold.

bsn, if you could find those loads for me that would be awesome!

Go with the RANCH DOG bullet mold!

I switched over in Nov 2007 from the LEE PRECISION which were miking about 0.457" and "rattling" down the bore of my M-1895 MARLIN. I am enclosing a picture of what "persistence" is worth. Granted, I did use my SHARPS M-1874 for this demo, but the reason that I am enclosing it, is because I expect to do every bit as well when the snow and cold weather are gone in Wisconsin, come Spring.

Before I forget, I am including a load source for you. I works for me and doesn't "beat the tar out of the shooter."

Another thing, for my MARLIN M-1895, I didn't have a lot of time to fine tune my loads before deer hunting (Wisconsin-Nov 17th), I did manage to get 2" + groups with my 425 gr (wheelweight material) bullets and gas checks at 100 yd.

Stalker76z, I have used this load reference as well for my GG, but I used Starline Brass and got a little nervous that I was pushing the pressure a little too hard, even with the Winchester brass that I had. I pulled back to 42 gr and got a good load (about 1600 fps, if I recall), but plan on working back up now that I have a working chronograph and deer season is winding down. Very accurate loads, though, in the hot and milder loads!

I'm mainly looking for a safe 300-350 gr load that pushes 1900-2000fps that I can use with the 5lb of RL7 that I already own.

Thanks for the reply, good to know that this is working for someone else in a similar gun.

The Lee Sizer is like a die that you screw into your press. You get a ram that goes in the press ram that pushes the bullets nose first thru the die into a container that come with the sizer die as the storage case. Pushing against the base means you don't need a nose punch to push the bullet back out of the sizer like the Lyman or RCBS's.

The liquid Alox system Lee designed uses his bullet liquid alox lube. It's applied by "tumble lubing". You put a couple or three dozen bullets in a cottage cheese container and dribble a few drops of the liquid alox on them then just swirl around til the bullets are coated. It doesn't take much. You then set them up on a piece of tinfoil or wax paper and let them dry overnight. At that point if they need sized or need gas checks I run them thru the sizer which attaches the gas checks. I will then tumble lube again to get a good coat on them and let dry over night.

You can run them thru the sizer without tumble lubing to attach the gas checks, but they seem to go so much easier if their lubed before. I use a really light coat both times. It just doesn't take much, actually way less than you think is needed. This system puts the lube on the outside of the bullets where it's most effective. Lee says you can heat the bullet with a torch and it won't seperate from the lead even as it melts.

I used a lubra-sizer for years and Lee's system is so much easier and so much less expensive both in lube and for the equipment. I haven't had any leading problems and can't tell any difference in the way the bullets shoot.

I now shoot several Lee bullets that are designed just for tumble lubing and don't require a sizer. They can be shot as cast with great results. Anyway not putting down the lubri-sizer systems, they do a good job, but I like the ease of the Lee system.

Here's where you can look at the sizing equipment and the liquid alox.

http://www.leeprecision.com/cgi/catalog/browse.cgi?1116728482.5129=/html/catalog/lubesize.html

QUESTION: Why would a shooter want to use a LEE PRECISION Lube and Sizing Kit that size jumps from 0.457" to 0.501" with NO DIE SIZING IN BETWEEN? If the LEE PRECISION Lube and Sizing Kit is so great, why then would a shooter want to size at a 0.457" size with a 0.460" RANCH DOG bullet, that is deliberately larger in diameter to prevent gases shooting by the sides of the bullet at ignition? AM I MISSING SOMETHING HERE???

POINT: I have had problems with LEE PRECISION bullets that I have cast which mic out at a consistent 0.457" with wheel weights material. These bullets "rattle" down my bore of my MARLIN M-1895 and I am lucky to get a 100 yard "pattern" of 10+ inches. A couple of months ago, some kind soul put me wise to RANCH DOG molds, size 0.460" in 425 gr with gas checks----exactly "what the doctor ordered" for my MARLIN. Because of the on-set of winter and gun deer season in Wisconsin, I wasn't able to "fine-tune" the .460" - 425 gr bullet from RANCH DOG. However, I have been able to considerably tighten up my 10-in "pattern" to about 0.03" over 2 inches at 100 yards. I believe this will be the "magic bullet" for my rifle.

I had the same quandary at first myself, Stalker76z, but the answer is at the same website, ranchdogmolds. He sells the .460 Lee kit for about $15 IIRC, and this is the one that I was refering to. It was not avab. when I bought the die for the Saeco lubrisizer that I use, and that die alone cost as much as the Lee kit. Check it out at Ranch Dog's site.

Thanks. I'll check on it.

I have a couple of Ranch Dog molds and his Lee sizing dies, they just plain work:D The 460-350 for my 1895 CB and the 432-265 for my 444’s. No leading when using LLA, but my rifles have been firelapped. I shoot the 265gr. at over 2300fps in the XLR with no leading.
I don’t use R- 7 , but 49gr of H 4198 and the 460-350 works for me.

Stalker you can also call Lee and they will make you a .460 siszing die, I got mine a while ago, I think I paid about $20.00 so if Ranch Dog has one that would be faster and less expensive.

I had the same quandary at first myself, Stalker76z, but the answer is at the same website, ranchdogmolds. He sells the .460 Lee kit for about $15 IIRC, and this is the one that I was refering to. It was not avab. when I bought the die for the Saeco lubrisizer that I use, and that die alone cost as much as the Lee kit. Check it out at Ranch Dog's site.

Do you ever, or have you tried the size 0.460" tumble lube bullet from RANCH DOG MOLDS as cast, w/o benefit of running them through the sizing die? I have heard (I believe somewhere on this website) that even at slightly oversized (0.002"???) that would NOT increase the chamber pressure significantly to a danger level.

I have a couple of Ranch Dog molds and his Lee sizing dies, they just plain work:D The 460-350 for my 1895 CB and the 432-265 for my 444’s. No leading when using LLA, but my rifles have been firelapped. I shoot the 265gr. at over 2300fps in the XLR with no leading.
I don’t use R- 7 , but 49gr of H 4198 and the 460-350 works for me.

Rowdy, How fast is this 350gr boolit w/49gr H4198 moving? What kind of trajectory does it give you out to 200 yd?

EastTNHunter-
Around 1900fps,IIRC, shooting 3" high at 100yds it was 6" low at 200yds. The load comes from here;
http://www.ranchdogmolds.com/TLC460350RF/4570Data/H4198.html

It's not too bad to shoot in the cold, but with no recoil-pad in short sleeves it'll leave a mark.:D

Do you ever, or have you tried the size 0.460" tumble lube bullet from RANCH DOG MOLDS as cast, w/o benefit of running them through the sizing die? I have heard (I believe somewhere on this website) that even at slightly oversized (0.002"???) that would NOT increase the chamber pressure significantly to a danger level.

I have shot about 50 of the 460-350 lubed with LLA unsized and without GC's. I was using 13gr of Trail Boss at 1000fps. The boolits were running about .461"- .462" with a slight amount of leading.

Stalker,

JMHO but 'as cast' are for plinking. I do not have any molds that cast perfectly round boolits. Size em for accuracy and for hunting.

Dave:cool:

Yep, I really can't see how expecting an "unsized" bullet would keep the same accuracy as one that has been sized. As this target can attest to, I nearly "fell over" when I got up to the target after shooting my SHARPS. I am going to try hard to get similar accuracy from my my M-1895-------probably won't happen, but I would be satisfied with less than an inch at 100 yd, considering that max range would be about 125 or so with a 425 gr bullet.