I've almost got my new BFR 45-70, and I want to start making some loads for it. I've got some Lasercast 350g bullets that I want to burn up, But I'm not sure how to load them for the bfr. What I want to do is start with a pretty tame load, and increase it a little at a time so I can get use to it. I'm not too concerned with accuracy yet. Anyway, any suggestions on a starting load? and how many grains should I increase it to gain a couple 100 fps? I'll make about 20 rounds, and then bump it up.

For some reason I can't get into Loadswap.

Pardon my ignorance;what is a bfr? a big fuxxing rifle?
I have some low end loads with a 320 grain bullet
40 grains of RX7 powder with daron filler
The Lyman book lists 47 grains as a starting point,@1687FPS
Good luck,
Frank

If you are going to reload for the BFR in 45-70 I suggest you get some reloading manuals, also there are a number of places that have load data on the Internet.
The BFR can safely use trapdoor and Marlin load data.

Frank,
http://www.magnumresearch.com/Expand.asp?ProductCode=BFR45-707

Redhawk, I have load books for 45-70, But I've never shot a 45-70 handgun. I was hoping someone with a bfr had a mellow plinking load that I can start with that is about 1000fps.

I want to make batches of 10 or 20 that start at about 1000fps, and increase each batch by 100fps or so. But I don't have a chrono.

How does RL-7 work in the shorter barrel? The loads I was making for my 1895gs used it, and I've still got 2 pounds of it.

woodwright, I have a BFR in 45-70, I have shot some mild loads in mine, I was using the trapdoor load data, that is mild in the BFR. I hunt with Marlin loads. Also if you want to keep the recoil down, use light bullets as well. I use 405 gr. hard cast for light and heavy loads in my BFR. If you want light loads use cowboy action loads, here is one that is very light. 11 gr. of Unique, about 900 fps in a BFR handgun.

http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/RecipePrint.aspx?title=Cowboy+Load&gtypeid=5&weight=405&shellid=1009&bulletid=449&bdid=84&oal=2.55
http://www.realguns.com/loads/4570cast.htm
http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/RecipeDetail.aspx?title=Centerfire%20Load&gtypeid=2&weight=400&shellid=1099&bulletid=354
http://www.realguns.com/loads/4570tc.htm

Alliant Powder does not recommend reloding for 45-70 revolvers, I don't know why they post this on there web site, but I use there data. Maybe it is a legal thing.

I have shot every powder that can be used in the 45-70, working loads over and over. I have settled on the one single powder that always gives the best accuracy, burns completely, has mild recoil even with hunting loads.
That powder is SR 4759. I use the Federal 155, LP mag primer.
With the 350 gr boolit I would start at 30 gr's and work to 31.5 gr's looking for the accurate spot.
The BFR does not have bad recoil so just forget about plinking loads because they will not be as accurate.
These are my most accurate loads;
300 gr Hornady-32.5 gr's 4759, Fed 155
317 gr gc cast-31 gr's
330 gr gc cast- 31.5 gr's
350 hp & 360 solid gc cast-30 gr's
378 gr pb cast-30 gr's
448 gr gc cast-26 gr's
420 gr gc cast-27 gr's
Every one of these has done under 1" at 50 yd's and some have done 1" at 100 yd's.
Here are just a few test targets. The large left target was a sighter for hunting and the center group is 5 shots in 7/16" at 50 yd's.
OOPS, that 100kb thing. I have to reduce the picture.

I had to make it small but here it is

BFR,

Thanks for the info, that is really helpful. I just hope I can shoot that good when I'm your age.:D What kind of scope is that?

Who makes sr 4759?

That looks like an Ultra-dot on his BFR and IMR makes the sr4759

I have a Leupold 2x on my 45-70 BFR and an Ultra-dot on my BFR 500 Mag.

That is an Ultra Dot. They are reasonable and hold up to any recoil. I use one on my BFR .475 too. Check out Ultra Dot West for best prices.
IMR for the powder, SR means sporting rifle. It is bulky and fills a lot of the case too.
I could get better groups with a scope but I can't see good enough through one in the mornings or evenings for hunting. Long eye relief scopes are dark.

thanks. That'll get me started.

I use the Federal 155, LP mag primer.



Is there a reason you use the Federal 155 LP mag primer? Did you try any of the LR primers?

Just curious as to why the large pistol primer in a rifle case.

Thanks
Alex

Yes. You don't need the heat or pressure for 4759. Then the BFR 45-70 does not have the 28# mainspring needed for LR primers although I changed mine to a Wolfe 26#.
I also use the same primer in my BFR .475 even though the parent case is the 45-70.
Standard springs are 22 to 23#, the 500 S&W and the .450 Marlin have the 28# springs.
Plus accuracy is better in the 45-70 revolver and even the Federal 150 shoots super tight groups.
I also use the Fed 150 in my 45-70 BPCR loads. The mild ignition is better for Swiss black powder.
If I was shooting a slow powder from a 45-70 rifle, I would go to the LR primer.

OK, I have been shooting factory 45-70 rounds to get some brass to reload, I have not had a problem with the LR primers.

But I guess I am going to try the large rifle primers, I don't have any large pistol magnum primers, just large pistol.

In my Marlin 45-70 I use H332 and IMR 4198, but wanted to try something new in the BFR.

Try the LP primers first. They work great.
322 and 4198 are a little too slow for the revolver. I had pressure excursions with 4198, jumping from 1500 fps to 1800 fps, sticking a case now and then. Believe it or not, Varget was better.
I used a lot of LR primers with the slower powders but with 4759 I found no advantage at all.
I do not want the pressure of the LR primer to move a boolit out of the case before the powder gets a good burn either. I think that was what was happening with 4198. The boolit takes a long run to the forcing cone, unlike a rifle where the boolit is held in by the rifling allowing the powder to start good.
You need good neck tension and a firm crimp with the BFR because of the long throats. No sense messing it up by having the primer blow everything loose first.

I'll try the Large Pistol primers also. I have a bunch of the Winchester LP primers.

Sorry double post....

BFRshooter, I went and got some federal 155 primers to try out.

Let me know how it shoots for you.

I got the bullets loaded. I loaded 405 gr hard cast bullets from Montana Bullet works. I used 27.0 gr. of SR4759 and Federal 155 primers. I did notice that the large pistol magnum primes are seated deeper than the large rifle primers, I knew they were shorter but not that much.

It feels like a lot but there is only a .010" difference. There should be no problem with firing pin impact and reach.
Here are three groups shot at 50 yd's. The left is the Mnt Molds 462-420, three shots with 28.5 gr's 4759.
Top one is three shots with the Hornady bullet with 32.5 gr's.
Right one is my deer sight in target with 2 five shot groups using my 317 gr boolit and 31 gr's. Last five in the center measure 7/16".
Have no doubt, the gun will SHOOT! :D

I can't wait to get to the range. I put a new Leupold 2X on my BFR and want to get it sighted in and see what these loads will do.

I have clanged steel at 500 meters over and over by aiming about 26 feet high at a tree branch with the Ultra Dot.
You won't have any fun until you get WAY out there. :p
Don't even think about 25 yd's, big waste of boolits and time.
Here is the drop for mine;
100 yd's, Zero
150 yd's, -4"
200 yd's, -16"
500 meters, -26'----:eek:

Kragman:

Magnum Research's "Biggest, Finest Revolver" is basically a Blackhawk on steroids. It will shoot all of today's hotrod revolver rounds, as well as some of the lower pressure rifle rounds.

Darrel

I have shot every powder that can be used in the 45-70, working loads over and over. I have settled on the one single powder that always gives the best accuracy, burns completely, has mild recoil even with hunting loads.
That powder is SR 4759. I use the Federal 155, LP mag primer.
With the 350 gr boolit I would start at 30 gr's and work to 31.5 gr's looking for the accurate spot.
The BFR does not have bad recoil so just forget about plinking loads because they will not be as accurate.
These are my most accurate loads;
300 gr Hornady-32.5 gr's 4759, Fed 155
317 gr gc cast-31 gr's
330 gr gc cast- 31.5 gr's
350 hp & 360 solid gc cast-30 gr's
378 gr pb cast-30 gr's
448 gr gc cast-26 gr's
420 gr gc cast-27 gr's
Every one of these has done under 1" at 50 yd's and some have done 1" at 100 yd's.
Here are just a few test targets. The large left target was a sighter for hunting and the center group is 5 shots in 7/16" at 50 yd's.
OOPS, that 100kb thing. I have to reduce the picture.

I loaded some 350g lasercasts over 28.5g of Sr 4759, and have shot about 30 without incident. Today, I was shooting and had a round go "POP". The last time I saw this happen, another reloader had forgotten to charge a case with powder and the primer had pushed the bullet into the barrel far enough that the cylinder wouldn't rotate. Figuring this was the same deal I packed up and went home, as I didn't have any sort of rod to drive the bullet back.

When I got home I Got the bullet pushed back ad unloaded it. But I was surprised to find the case was still full of powder. What gives? Should I use a filler? Is there another powder that fills the case up a little better, and is easier to meter? My powder measure throws over a full grain different from charge to charge, so I have resorted to Lee dippers.

I have never had that happen but I use the Fed primers. I have worn out a lot of brass with thousands of rounds and every one has been perfect.
I do use a tuft of dacron for my accuracy loads but have shot many without it.
I can't give you an answer on that one, the powder is easy to light. You could have had a primer not seated all the way and the pin had to seat it first before it went off.
You will be hard pressed to find a better powder.
Another reason would be inadequate case tension. With the large case and the distance you blew a boolit with just the primer, I would say your boolits are too loose. They should not move before the powder lights.
I use Hornady dies only because the expander is the right size. If you have other dies, polish down the expander a little to tighten things up.
A lot of guys use the Lyman "M" expander but they leave the brass so loose you can almost seat by hand, NOT good for the revolver. Even the normal Lyman expander is too large.
Another big problem is Winchester brass, it is too thin and needs a smaller expander yet. Starline and Federal makes the best with Remington third.
Give me more information on your loads.

I'm useing the 155 primers, and a new set of lee dies. The dies actually size the case down a lot. I measured .439 inside the neck. And the bell die barely opens it enough. I haven't got a factory crimp die yet so I'm useing the seater die to crimp. I'm not real impressed with these dies.

I'm working with a mixed batch of cases until I can replace them. The case in question was a PMC.

How do you meter it? My rcbs powder measure doesn't like it, But once I get a new shellplate kit for my dillon, I would like to be able to use the dillon measure. It is a slide bar type so I think it should work better. Or should I just stick with measuring each charge?

WOW, that will wear out brass! :mad:
My Hornady dies size to .450" and the expander opens them to .455" BUT only to a depth of about .225 to .250". The rest of the case below that is tighter, as sized and gives a good grip on the boolit.
Then I use .459 boolits so I have .002" grip on the top 1/4" and tighter below that for the rest of the boolit. Need fairly hard boolits for this. I can see the grease grooves on the brass, also the base.
The powder is like all other stick rifle powders and does not measure good. I throw out of my Redding BR measure into the pan to just short of what I want and dribble to the setting.
I would not trust the Dillon. I want to see what is in my cases.
Your dies will make or break revolver accuracy real fast. I get better accuracy from Hornady dies then any others but I also use Redding's for a lot of calibers too.
I no longer use RCBS and would not buy Lee dies, at least not for revolvers, although I use a lot of other Lee stuff. RCBS is OK for rifles.

bfrshooter, I was reading back through this post looking for some velocity readings with the 4759 but couldn't find any. I'm loading 32g under a 350g lasercast bullet. Have you shot them in a rifle? I've got an 1895gs that seems to like them pretty well. If you ever find yourself in north Idaho i'd love to go shooting with you:D:D:D

The only loads I chronographed are the 317 gr boolits. I get 1632 fps. You should not be too far from that. I never shot them from my BPCR but shot the boolit from an original rolling block with 3031. I had one ragged hole at 50 yd's but they were too low. I had to go to a 500 gr gov't boolit and 3031 to hit center. My friend killed a bunch of deer with that load.
I suppose 4759 would work great too out of a rifle. I didn't want to waste my powder on his gun though. The stuff is hard to find here.