Do not count the wildcats, just the factory available cartridges at present or in past production. I guess we should say that the parent must still be in current production. This should not be a debated issue although I guess there could be a tie or two.

What is it? No guessing.

And I have to add, I have no clue.

The 45-70 would certainly be high on the list, especially for cartridges that achieved "factory"status, and is most certainly the oldest.

7X57 Mauser!
The 30/06's daddy!

George

I'd have to say the 308 Win. We have:
243 Win
260 Rem
7mm-08
338 Federal
358 Win

6 offspring. Or is the 6.8 SPC off the 308 case?

Or is it the 30-06? With that we have:
25-06 Rem
270 Win
280 Rem
338-06 (could be some debate about this...Weatherby did load for this, but don't know if it's still current production)
35 Whelen (this is currently loaded, isn't it?)

5 offspring. Looks like the 308 wins between the two, but I may have forgotten one or two.

8iowa may be right about the 45-70 case....someone more knowledgeable than me will have to name off all those cartridges.

The 8x57mm begat the 12mm casehead in 1888. The 7x57 of 1892 is a necked down 8x57 and the .30-06 is a lengthened 8x57. Pre-WW I we have a number of European cartridges, the .256 Newton, .250 Savage and .45 ACP. Between the wars we have the .270 Winchester and the .257 Roberts, although the .22-250, .25-06 and .35 Whelen were wildcatted in this period. Post WW II the .30-06 was shortened to the .308 Winchester. The 6mm Remington is a necked down .257 Roberts. The 6.8 SPC is from the .30 Remington case and isn't in this family.

Bye
Jack

consider the 375 h&H. 300 h&h, 8mm rem. mag., most if not all early Wby. cartridges, 416 hoffman which evolved into 416 rem., i believe the 458 win. is a shotened version and from that came the 338 win., and the list goes on. sure someone else will be able to make corrections to this

All the magnum cases that were spawned from the 375 H&H make a big lineup if you include the short mags along with the long ones.

264 win mag
7mm Rem mag
300 win mag
All the Weatherby mags on that case
308 Norm mag
300 Win mag
8mm Rem mag
338 Win mag
358 Norm mag
375 H&H mag
458 Win mag and on and on.

That's got to qualify for one of the most prolific of the bunch

If we're just talking case head size then the .308 and all its' offspring are decendants of the 30/06 which is a decendant of the 8x57. That is the most common head size.

If we're just talking case head size then the .308 and all its' offspring are decendants of the 30/06 which is a decendant of the 8x57. That is the most common head size.

Jack brought up a good point about case head with the 8x57. Guess we need to go the thread starter about the rule on this one!:p I can see the argument about the 308 being a decendant of the 30-06, and the 30-06 being a decendant of the 8x57 (in case head dimension only). However, it's tough to lengthen a case and be an offspring....and thus, I'd make the argument that the 30-06 is not an offspring of the 8x57. Chief, what are your rules??;)

Doesn't seem to matter, I think Richard and Bob nailed it on the 375 H&H case. Or is it the 300 H&H case....which came first?

The .375 H&H Magnum was introduced in 1912 and the .300 H&H Magnum in 1925. The first belted case was the .400/375 H&H Belted Nitro Express of 1905. This is a .30-06 sized case with a belt and is the parent of the .240 Weatherby Magnum.

http://ammoguide.com/?catid=150

Lengthening a case is possible. IIRC the procedure is in George C. Nonte's book "Cartridge Conversions". However, if the U.S. Army wanted a longer case, they got a longer case from the factory. None of this diddling around we handloaders do. The one thing I forgot was that the longer case was the .30-03 (2.540"), and the shorter .30-06 (2.494") came later. Guess how long the .270 Winchester case is.

.400-375 pic attached.

Bye
Jack

Uh-oh, 270 Win is 2.540". Have to drop it from the 30-06 lineup.:D

I was surprised, I counted 38 cartridges that share the head dimensions of the 45-70. There were a few wildcats, even one Rigby, so I wouldn't consider them all "offspring". Most were old black powder cartridges that are long forgotten. That's not bad for an old "parent", or should I say "great-grandpappy".

If it comes down to wildcats, the old British belted magnum case has really been prolific. My source is "The Handloader's Manual of Cartridge Conversions".

You could make a case to add the 280 AI to the '06 list since Nosler has legitimized that chambering

Not the most prolific but an honarable mention should go to 38-55 Win.

from it we get or can get
25-35
30-30
.32 Win
.32-40
7-30 Waters
.375 Win
219 Zip
22 High Power

probably a bunch i forgot.

Another that would go to mention would be the .222 Rem. Mag. and its litter.

I thought this would be a definite answer with no question. Boy was I wrong. I also figured that the term parent may be debated and the current production part.

Good info none the less. Thanks guys.

6 offspring. Or is the 6.8 SPC off the 308 case?

Or is it the 30-06? With that we have:
25-06 Rem
270 Win
280 Rem
338-06 (could be some debate about this...Weatherby did load for this, but don't know if it's still current production)
35 Whelen (this is currently loaded, isn't it?)



The 6.8 SPC is based off the old 30 Remington. The 338-06 is a production, registered with SAAMMI as the 338-06 A-Square and the Whelen is currently produced in the Rem 700's. My vote is for the 375 H & H.