Cougars are incredibly thick in south eastern Idaho, I can’t over emphasize that; they are thicker than seems possible. They are also comfortable in town. Recently, as exotic wolves have expanded, they are increasingly thicker in towns, and not shy about being seen. 25 years ago, an urban cougar took some getting used to, but now, I’m comfortable with it.

What has me bothered is the increase in cougar traffic mortality in town. Certain stretches of road seem to be taking a lot of cougars. I contacted the Department of Transportation to see if they would put up some “Mountain Lion Crossing” signs, similar to “Deer Crossing” signs, in towns. They agreed there is a problem, but weren’t too hot on the idea. The constant deer traffic mortalities, at the “Deer Crossing” signs in towns, seems to be the reason.

What has me worried is that I don’t see how we can maintain our urban populations if so many keep being killed by careless motorists. I remember when there were vicious dogs running loose all through town, vandals and burglars roaming our streets at night. Urban cougars serve a very useful purpose in our modern towns.

You know Silvertip up here in this part of Idaho (The Clearwater Drainage) I saw three cougars over the past 50 years, then a few years ago we started seeing them in our backyard of the little town of 150 folks that I Live in. Along with a increasing deer population to the point we can no longer raise a garden without an electric fence around it were seeing more bear, elk and moose in the fringes of town where we never had that problem before.

I've had a cougar in my backyard now for two years in a row. Never seen a moose near town, but did last year. I'm wondering if the wolves are pushing them out of the logging country into this farming country. We live in deep canyon country and it's basically not accessable except on the edges.

Our nearest big city, Lewiston, Id and Clarkston, WA 40 miles away has seen an increase of cougar and bear sightings in town. Were waiting now to hear if there is going to be a wolf hunt and tags available this fall concurrent with big game season. That's what friends in Fish and Game are telling me they want to do.

Heck - they've got cougars in the little city park of North Chicago, Ill. Had the tracks in the snow on national TV the other day. Said they were gonna warn the folks that take regular walks in the area.

Wonder about the folks that take irregular walks! :D

Send some of them polecats to Jersey!

We could feed them some of our "undesirables", or claen out the prisons with em.
Yep, fat happy polecats.
:D

Bob, your now sounds like us 25 years ago. Our urban visiting deer herds seem to have thinned out a bit since (mostly a bad Winter kill and building sprees at two of their favorite urban areas, two different herds). Last week, two cougars were hit on a stretch of road one property removed from a friend in Pocatello’s back yard (separate incidents). Week before that, 5 different cougars officially seen in Pocatello. Most people don’t report sightings, but officials do.

kdub, it’ hard to explain both Chicago parks and Idaho Forests. The Caribou and Targhee National Forests are collections of National Forest areas; some of which are smaller than some of Chicago’s parks. For over 100 years, Illinois officials denied they had any cougars, then one week, two were hit by trains. Peoria also has some cougars like to visit.

I think the large amount of deer we have in the area is helping draw in some of the cougar population were experiencing. 40 years ago here in Peck my mom had 2 acres of garden and we never had a deer problem. I attributed it to the fact that most folks had a dog in town and they pretty well kept the deer out, but we've still got lots of dogs here and the deer have just taken over.

8 foot fences, electric fences and just not having a garden are the only way we cope with the deer herds that roam our yards. I'm not sure what the local town deer population is, but I would guess between 50 and 75 at any given time.

So far this year I haven't seen the cougar back, but there's been one in my backyard the last two years. The folks that live up behind me had one come within 30 feet of where they were grilling some burgers on their deck.

Our little town sits a mile from the Clearwater river and is 10 miles from the nearest other town and in the bottom of a deep set of canyons that feed creeks off of the Camas Prairie into the Clearwater River. Folks dryland farm wheat and barley up on top.

Home is in the bottom of this canyon.

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q172/faucettb/Around%20Home/TownofPeck.jpg

Here's what it looks like on top.

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q172/faucettb/Around%20Home/PraireabovePeck2.jpg

These steep canyons keep folks away from hunting and elk, bear, deer both whitetail and mulies, cougar, coyotes and bobcats and moose live here where few folks dare to try to hunt the steep canyons.

This is Big Canyon creek above my place. Hunting these canyon walls almost always means bringing game up to the top once it's been shot. Big cats love this kind of country.

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q172/faucettb/Around%20Home/BigCanyonabovePeck.jpg

There have been cougar sightings in a popular wooded park located along some bluffs in my hometown... this is literally in some people's backyards. It really wouldn't be a problem if there weren't alot of families in the neighborhood and lots of little kids running through the trails in the park... there really aren't any "undesireable" people to clear out first.

What has me worried is that I don’t see how we can maintain our urban populations if so many keep being killed by careless motorists. I remember when there were vicious dogs running loose all through town, vandals and burglars roaming our streets at night. Urban cougars serve a very useful purpose in our modern towns.


Please tell me this is this a joke..."careless motorists" killing cougars is a problem for the cougars? How about uncontrolled wildlife being a problem and accident hazard for motorists? How should a "careful" motorist drive...10 mph all the time in case a cougar might happen to decide to commit suicide in front of their car? Maybe the DOT would post crossing signs, if the animals knew enough to read and follow the signs.

Get real...these predators do not belong in urban areas. Otherwise, please tell me you were kidding, so my blood pressure can return to normal.

Gents;

Please keep this civil, or it's locked.

I have to agree Cougars are too small and timid to assist with urban problems.

Leopards now! Oakland, Berkley, or even Boise parks; perhaps?

Gents;

Please keep this civil, or it's locked.

No incivility intended, but still interested in knowing if silvertipmo was writing tongue-in-cheek, like the other posters, or if he was seriously stating his POV. As an employee of a "DOT", I'm in charge of posting animal crossing signs, so have a POV also.

I got a call once from a lady asking me to move a deer crossing sign to a safer crossing spot for the animals to cross. Like they say..."It takes all kinds".

Well I wish I knew where one of these Idaho Cougars was standing around, I have a tag for such incidents and would love to use it.
Unlucky I guess as I have lived out of town for the most part of my life. Worked in the Mtn's and where cougars are thousands of hours, been a outdoorsy kind guy since I was old enough to get outside, and I have never seen one in the wild. I guess I have seem most critters that walk the lower 48 except a caribou, wolverine and a grizzly, even a lynx once , maybe, as at the distance we were never sure it wasn't a large bobcat, even seen one of these new wolf's they turned loose. I have even heard a cougar scream , scaring the heck out of horses, just never seen one in the flesh, darn!

I got a call once from a lady asking me to move a deer crossing sign to a safer crossing spot for the animals to cross. Like they say..."It takes all kinds". Worked at Mt Rainier Natl Park quite a bit and we had a lady ask one of my crew "when do the deer become elk?". On a cloudy day I had another lady ask me "what time does the mountain come out".

Bob, I meant to ask you to wax a bit more specific on what keeps deer out; HELP; they can be a nuisance!

leverite, I know where you’re coming from. First time I had one on the porch, in the drive, in the yard, well… it took some getting used to. They don’t jump into cars like deer, or wander into the road with a dazed and confused look in their eyes like bear, or charge oncoming traffic like moose. Kind of hard to put into a three word message for a sign. After a full night of catting around, they like to stretch out on warm pavement and catch some ZZZ’s. Citified cougars know better, but new ones take a while to learn. Slowing down and honking the horn will resolve the situation in a flash. But rush hour traffic just drives right over them. Only talking 3-6 per year, but from a small population.
I wish I could tell you that I was kidding, I know your problems; we hunt cougars aggressively seven months out of the year and it does make a huge difference in our relations. One might like to take a stroll after dinner, buy a fine cigar for the stroll back; and admire people’s yards both ways, as the weeks bring different plants into bloom. But would have to pack for aggressive loose dogs, and observe the fences that have been torn down, bushes destroyed and ornamental trees cut down by vandals; not to mention the burglaries, and no car was safe. Minors have cart blanche, nothing the police can do; one could ask around and arrange to buy back their stuff, but that only encouraged them. All in all, I much prefer the cougars.

Chris, Oregon has passed some very bad laws affecting human/cougar relations. leverite was not being discourteous; but reacting to his situation, as I’m reacting to mine.

Most folks here are putting 20 mile electric fencers on small garden plots to keep the deer out. Some have put in 8 foot high fences. Other than that your just planting for the deer.

I sure hear what your saying about the juveniles, Cops here seem to ignore them for the most part.

Bob, I meant to ask you to wax a bit more specific on what keeps deer out; HELP; they can be a nuisance!

leverite, I know where you’re coming from. First time I had one on the porch, in the drive, in the yard, well… it took some getting used to. They don’t jump into cars like deer, or wander into the road with a dazed and confused look in their eyes like bear, or charge oncoming traffic like moose. Kind of hard to put into a three word message for a sign. After a full night of catting around, they like to stretch out on warm pavement and catch some ZZZ’s. Citified cougars know better, but new ones take a while to learn. Slowing down and honking the horn will resolve the situation in a flash. But rush hour traffic just drives right over them. Only talking 3-6 per year, but from a small population.
I wish I could tell you that I was kidding, I know your problems; we hunt cougars aggressively seven months out of the year and it does make a huge difference in our relations. One might like to take a stroll after dinner, buy a fine cigar for the stroll back; and admire people’s yards both ways, as the weeks bring different plants into bloom. But would have to pack for aggressive loose dogs, and observe the fences that have been torn down, bushes destroyed and ornamental trees cut down by vandals; not to mention the burglaries, and no car was safe. Minors have cart blanche, nothing the police can do; one could ask around and arrange to buy back their stuff, but that only encouraged them. All in all, I much prefer the cougars.

Chris, Oregon has passed some very bad laws affecting human/cougar relations. leverite was not being discourteous; but reacting to his situation, as I’m reacting to mine.

Thanks silvertipmo...Washington has the same type of laws as Oregon and the elk are suffering in both states. Didn't realize that cougars were becoming so populous in Idaho where they are still hunted with hounds.

Got into a discussion w/ my physical therapist yesterday when I complained about how the cougars were taking so many elk calves. She had just been out camping in the Grande Ronde valley of Eastern Oregon and mentioned how she saw cougar tracks thru her campsite. She's a very petite gal who happens to be 8 mo's preggers and was blissfuly unaware of how close she might have to being munched on by a coug as she walked in the woods alone.

Her attitude is simialr to many urban folks...let the predators run free and don't even hunt them. I explained that it was the hunters and sportsmen who financially supported the repopulation of the elk herds and that if hunting goes down the tube, there won't be any revenues to the Fish and Game folks to do all their reintroduction and predator population monitoring studies.

But, we're still the bad guys.

You got to keep in mind that the wolves have devastated the hound hunters packs in this area. Where there used to be 50 guys here running cat and bear hounds there are 5 left. Over the last five years the wolves have torn our packs to shreds. Most folks have simply given up on trying to run cat and bear hounds. It's to the point where you can't even take your pets camping as they are just good snacks for the wolf packs.

You got to keep in mind that the wolves have devastated the hound hunters packs in this area. Where there used to be 50 guys here running cat and bear hounds there are 5 left. Over the last five years the wolves have torn our packs to shreds. Most folks have simply given up on trying to run cat and bear hounds. It's to the point where you can't even take your pets camping as they are just good snacks for the wolf packs.

Bob...that sure makes sense and I hadn't even thought of that angle. Very discouraging.

I haven't seen a cougar in the wild myself either. Although I've come across many of their kills. Matter of fact it's becoming more common for cougars to take deer (along with pets) in urban areas.

For a bunch of years I've deer hunted in the Black Hills National Forest. Several years ago a friend and I was talking about the lack of deer sign in areas that used to be over run with 'em. Anymore the best hunting is around housing developments ajoining forest service land.

I wonder if the heavy deer population in those areas is caused by deer seeking safety from the hunting pressure by cougars in the more remote locations? I know the few mountain lions we take during the season isn't scratching the surface of the reproduction rate.

As a comical side note, I heard the GF&P introduced mountain goats in some black hills units. The deprediation is so bad from mountain lions, they are unlikely to survive.

Same thing happened in Arizona in the Aravipa Wilderness area - G&F introduced desert bighorns back in the hills, which promptly got eaten by the lions. Cats had a contented and lip smacking smile on their faces! :D