Hi All, I'm thinking about going to a small cal small game rifle, something like .17 ackley hornet / .19 Calhoon / .19 Badger / .22 hornet / K hornet.
I'm in New Zealand, so getting either a rifle or rifle parts (from the U.S.)is turning out to be more than just placing an order and waiting for a package to arrive, anyway... Saw an add for a Winchester Model 54 in 22 Hornet for sale, needs new barrel, so is a candidate for some of the above. I haven't had anything to do with the M 54, so can anyone help with how suitable the action is to use for a project like this? Can anyone see any pitfalls, apart from using a 70 year old plus rifle (add says in good condition)? What are peoples thoughts Win M54 vs CZ 527 action for something like this? What is a M54 worth in the U.S.?
Thanks for your help.
Brendon

Model 54 Winchester's are becoming quite collectible here in the US. I'm not really sure of the values, but they can bring a tidy sum in good condition.

As for a candidate for rebarreling it's just a matter of having a gunsmith unscrew the old barrel and chamber and install a new one. It would make a dandy varmint rifle and if you had a smith turn the new barrel to the same contour as the take off one a very nice looking rifle.

As for the CZ 527 I have one in 204 Ruger and everyone I know that has one regardless of the caliber loves the accuracy these little rifles deliver.

I probably would opt for the 527 simply because if you break something on the Win 54 it may be really hard to get parts to fix it today. They haven't been made for a long time as you said.

Model 54 Winchester's are becoming quite collectible here in the US. I'm not really sure of the values, but they can bring a tidy sum in good condition.

As for a candidate for rebarreling it's just a matter of having a gunsmith unscrew the old barrel and chamber and install a new one. It would make a dandy varmint rifle and if you had a smith turn the new barrel to the same contour as the take off one a very nice looking rifle.

As for the CZ 527 I have one in 204 Ruger and everyone I know that has one regardless of the caliber loves the accuracy these little rifles deliver.

I probably would opt for the 527 simply because if you break something on the Win 54 it may be really hard to get parts to fix it today. They haven't been made for a long time as you said.

I agree! Converting a CZ-527 or just buying one in .204 Ruger would be much wiser than trying to convert a valuable collectable, like your Winchester M-54.

If the rifle needs a new barrel it is probably not very collectable. If the rifle is very nice outside, let’s say 95% or better, the condition of the bore means very little and I would not alter it. Considering where you are located it may well be to your financial advantage to use this action. The only shortcoming of the Model 54 Action I am aware of is the trigger sear is used as the bolt stop. If you have a good trigger put on the rifle don’t slam the bolt back against the stop.
Caliber selection is considerably more difficult. How large is the game you will hunt? I have a K-Hornet (TC Contender) and David White has reamed a .17 Ackley Hornet for us. Both barrels shoot very well.
Be aware not all “K-Hornets” have the same case shape. If you order a K-Hornet reamer today it is almost certain you will receive a “KE Hornet chamber” close but not the same thing.<?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>

The barrel replacement is straightforward on the rifle but the hardest part will be the cartridge magazine. I'm told the parts are hard to find and buy reasonably especially in the 22 Hornet shell format. Another shell based case may be easier to locate and purchase. Would check this part of the conversion first for availability and cost before deciding.

Bob, Davers, William and hailstone,
thanks for taking the time to reply. Not keen on the .204, already have .223 and that makes enough noise. Looking for cal that is reloadable, uses less than 20grains of powder, relatively low noise (although a suppressor is an option), capable of 250 yard consistant hits, to be used on rabbits/ hares/ magpies/ ferral goats (within 150 yards) and something a little different to the norm in N.Z.
cheers Brendon

With your parameters have you given thought to 221 Fireball. Uses 22 cal bullets and 17 grains of Reloader 7 powder. That might be easier to get the magazine parts for than the hornet.

CZ chambers the 527 in 22 Hornet, but 250 yards might be a stretch for that case. You could always load down your 223 some.

Your distances outclass the .17 Hornet and probably the .22 K-Hornet – with reliable case life. You can load the Hornet with bullets intended for larger cartridges and these will give better performance on goat sized critters. The plastic premium bullets will slug up at these lower impact velocities.
Ken Waters wrote the .221 Fireball was the cartridge the varmint hunters wanted in the 1930’s, it just hadn’t been invented yet. The Fireball slightly exceeds the performance of the R2-Lovell and will feed through a bolt action rifle without serious modification.
If you are lung shooting feral goats at 150-yards with the .22 K-Hornet you will have to follow them up.
If I were in your position (geographic) I would consider a wildcat similar to the .219 Donadlson Wasp based on the .303 British case. It would be different, may have already been done in limited numbers and you have several different rifle easily available to build on.

Awesome Guys! Yep, have been thinking of perhaps re-barrelling the .223, with 22" 1 in 8 twist & suppressor. Finding the best powder to download the .223 can be time and money intensive, as powder brands and types are limited, or can double in price if the importer lives in a different part of N.Z.
I'm seriously thinking about one of James Calhoon's .19 cals, if I can get either a barrel or complete rifle, without the cost of export / shipping / permits making the whole exercise fiscal stupidity. If I did, I'd also purchase enough projectiles to outlast either the rifle or me which ever came first. Some guys I have told about the idea, tell me I'm nuts, nothing new there LOL!
.17 cal next down the list, but would leave the goats alone, unless was sure of a good neck shot, at short range.
.17 hmr would be okay, but ammo is not cheap here (or reloadable) and looks as if the price might go higher.
Looks as if this is one of those what cal / which rifle? questions that is always good to get the juices flowing and can take some extra research to either confirm your original idea or leave you with other choices that just have you headache pills and the wife for the lawyer's phone number LOL!
cheers, I appreciate your help.
Brendon

270 converting an action to feed a rimless cartridge when it's designed to feed a rimmed cartridge such as the hornet may be a problem. You'd be much better off with an action designed for a rimless cartridge to start with.

I ran a gunsmith business for quite a while and if a customer brought in a project like your talking about I was always happy to do what he wanted or needed if it was physically possible. After all it was his money that was supporting my family at the time. Of course I explained the problems and gave him an estimate of the time and costs involved, but I was always glad to take as much money as he wanted to spend even if I felt at times that what he was doing was just flushing good money after bad.

With the 54 if you overcome the feeding problem your still stuck with a 70 year old rifle that if it breaks parts may be very hard to find. Barreling cost are immaterial compared to having a finished rifle with a broken extractor that has to be machined, tempered and perhaps forged by a master machinist to keep this old rifle functioning. Not that it may break, but any part can and will eventually wear out if it's used a bunch.

If you start with a modern rifle it's going to give you years of use with very little problems developing and in my estimation will be more value for your money in the long run.

As for your cartridge choices, I've never been much of a wildcatter and using bullets that have to be custom made always seemed silly to me. You never know when a day might come that the ability to use common production bullets may be a boon to obtaining ammo. I'm not suggesting that you don't go for a non-standard bore, but it's going to make costs higher for not only a barrel and chambering, but loading supplies also.

Like several posters said the hornet case simply can't be blown out enough to make it a 250 yard game killer. I've felt for years that the 223 was at the most a 350 yard Prairie dog gun and a 300 yard coyote gun. That easily falls into your range envelope. It may be that you already own an ideal rifle/cartridge combination for what your seeking.

Well you certainly got more than my 2 cents with your post. Sure hope you find that ideal caliber and rifle for your use.

Bob,
thanks again. I like the whole forum format, as you get people like your goodself, giving honest replies to try and help out others asking for help, not a sales pitch. So maybe perhaps a bit of a barrel trim and suppressor (to start with), may be all I need. I like my 26" barrel, but is a bit heavy to carry on foot all day. If I do go to .19 cal it would be either with a complete rifle or a .19-223 barrel fitted to my model 70.
Anyway the cost of an over barrel suppressor and shortneing/fitting is not too bad approx NZD$550.00. Anyway time for more thinking.
cheers Brendon

Brendon, the 19 Badger is a superb little round, but remember that Calhoon is the ONLY source of bullets for it - and any hiccup in getting them to NZ would leave you with no gun at all.

If you can drop your range requirement to 175 or even 200 yards, a Hornet should serve you well. It may not be a one-shot killer on the larger critters, but does kill far better than its "paper" numbers would lead us to believe. For all the reasons above, plus the unneeded weight, I'd pick a rifle other than the M-54. Or, simply use Start loads for your 223, which take you right down to Hornet ballistics effortlessly.

After “thumping” a skunk this morning with the 24” .300 Whisper I started thinking again about your cartridge options. A .300 Whisper or .25 caliber wildcat based on the .223 case is a good 250 yard option for critters goat size and smaller. Using heavy for the caliber bullets you can keep the noise level quite low, the trajectory surprisingly flat and good terminal energy at 200+ yards. Your goats are probably like ours – rather tenacious about life. If you missed it here is a thread on the .25 Myra
<ST1:p</ST1:p<O:p</O:p
http://shootersforum.com/showthread.htm?t=37688&highlight=.25 (http://shootersforum.com/showthread.htm?t=37688&highlight=.25)
<O:p</O:p
These are cartridges you don’t see everyday yet they are easy to work with and quite capable of long range kills on medium size critters. Either cartridge will respond well to a suppressor.
I always assume when a shooter is discussing a wildcat he understands they are relatively uncommon, more difficult and expensive to work with. I accept this and don’t consider this a liability.
<O:p</O:p
Are you familiar with the Bullet Factory (Oz)? Beartooth forum member Snow sent me some sample bullets from them and when he returns from his extended work outing we are going to shoot them in our rifles for comparison. The Bullet Factory is producing bullets optimized for soft skinned critters of medium weight.
<O:p</O:p
http://people.aapt.net.au/~nelltash5/bullet%20factory%2002/index.htm (http://people.aapt.net.au/~nelltash5/bullet%20factory%2002/index.htm)