OK, after finding that the new press I bought is defective, Midsouth's excelent costomer service is going to let me exchange the press kit for store credit. I am not certain of which press to buy but I am leaning toward the Hornady Lock-N-Load press. It seems to be built very well and has nice additional options. This press is about the same cost as the kit that I'm returning but does not come with any other accessories so they will have to be puchased additionaly(extra funding the wife must approve):D

Could I get some input from those who have used this press good or bad I would like to hear it.

What did you get that was defective?

For a regular single stage press I just don't see how you can beat the Lee Classic Cast.

I sure hope it wasn't this press you had to send back. : )

..........

No, it was not a Lee, that is the other line of presses that I'm concidering.

http://shootersforum.com/images/icons/icon5.gif Press opinions

Okay, my opinion is that the differences between presses is vastly over emphesized. The differences between them, so far as the end user is concerned, is splitting hairs. A feature that is significant to me may be pointless to you but that depends on loading method and .... opinion!

I often hear/read about how one maker or another holds to "tigher tolerances" than others. Rubbish. They all use state of the art machine tools to make them and they are all more than sufficent for the purpose. Well, sure, any maker may let a defective one slip by occasionally but that is no reason to suspect the entire line.

Actually, there is very little functional difference between the current top presses of all makers, reqardless of price so features make the difference. Lee's Classic Cast has the most user friendly features, one of the strongest frames and is as accurately made as any currently available. By head and shoulders, it's the best value on the market but, if you like the features of another brand better that one would be the better choice for you.

I just want a simple, strong, single stage (steel) press with a spent primer catcher that works, a handle that adjusts for length and angle, great rigidity under the max pressure of the ram, and all made in the USA at the lowest possible cost to me. Check it out, the only press that matches those criteria is the Lee Classic Cast.

(Trendy gimmicks such as the LNL die inserts, or non-progressive turret tops, leave me cold. I just don't see a 5 second die swap vs. a 20 second die swap as a significant difference.)

What impressed me about the Hornady press was the 500 free bullets with purchase. After subtracting the bullet cost, the new press cost me $20. Until I got the new Hornady press, I had been using a Lyman Spartan press I bought in 1965. They both do the same thing. I do like the Hornady press though. Excellent quality.

What's in your Wallet? This stuff has been on my bench now for 15 years with nary a problem. I've used most of the equipment on the market and agree with ranger. I certainly can't tell any differences in my reloads accuracy and I've been making my own ammo now for better than 45 years. I load everything from 204 Ruger to 300 Ultra-mag to 8mm Remington mag.

I like the turret press for handgun ammo, but have removed the auto-advance and load single stage style. It lets me keep a complete set of dies for each caliber set up ready to go.

http://i136.photobucket.com/albums/q172/faucettb/Reloading/ReloadingbenchRemodel-40.jpg

The little Lee aluminum O frame press seems to just crank out good ammo year after year and for a hundred bucks for the whole reloading kit it's a bargain. I can't tell you about the Hornedy press you mentioned, but I've got a Projector progressive in a box under my bench that's broken and even with their warrentee they told me it's probably going to cost a hundred bucks to be fixed. considering the whole Lee Anniversary kit costs around a hundred bucks with everything you need to load except dies that doesn't seem much of a bargain no matter how many bullets they give you.

I have an old Herter's Single Stage and an RCBS Rock Chucker, my next will be a Lee 4 holer. Les

I've heard nothing but good stuff about it. Some like it better than the Dillon 550B, especially the powder dispensing system, the extra station for a powder check die and, with the free bullet offer, a lot less expensive. Go for it.

Hello,

I have had the exact press you are reffering to for the past 5 years now. I have had no problems whatsoever for as long as I have owned it. It think the best feature of the press is actually the l-n-l feature. This allows you to switch out dies without having to re-adjust. Although the l-n-l sleeves cost extra, what is 10 bucks extra for every caliber?

I will have to disagree with the others saying there really isn't any differences between presses. I had a lee press before I bought the hornady, and there was no comparison. Sure, they both do the same thing, its just that I think the hornady press is a better made, smoother functioning press. I'm not trying to knock the lee brand, but a Lee press is just like every other product they make: CHEAP. It's like comparing a cheap bolt action rifle to say, a weatherby mk V, sure they both do the same thing, but the weatherby is just "Nicer".

My 2 cents,
vanbuzen9

The same end is accomplished with the Lee Turret but you swap out the entire turret head (with dies installed and adjusted) instead of 2, 3, or 4 individual dies. I believe that if you compare the price difference between the Hornady LnL and the Lee Cast Turret, you'll be able to afford far more than just 500 bullets.

I don't think any of us say there is no difference at all between presses, or guns or anything else. The issue is that there is no functional difference. Sure, there is a difference between Weatherby and Savage rifles but what deer will care?

Sure there is a difference between a cast iron Hornady press and anyone's light alum alloy presses too; there should be! But, assuming the same level of skill by the loader, the ammo made on the massive press will be no better than the ammo made on the lighter press. Or not?

Bottom line, much like with women, pretty stuff is nice but it always costs a lot more and works no better.

I can't see that LNL inserts and turret head swaps do anything that standard lock rings don't do for normal die swaps/adjustments. Or am I missing something????

ranger the LNL inserts and Lee's new press with a simular option let you adjust dies once and just swap them in and out. I don't think your missing anything, but it does make die changing easier. This may just be a gimmick or it may be a boon to the reloader, time will tell. Only thing I know for sure is the interchangeable ten buck turrets for my old Lee press preloaded with different calibers is sure dandy to change around quickly.

The only gripe I have about the Hornedy progressive press is from an engineering standpoint. The rotational mechanism on the broken one I have under my reloading bench depends on a 3/16 inch roll pin to initiate and complete rotation. The whole rotational forces are concentrated on that one roll pin.

It broke on this press and then the fella that owned it tried to drive it out without using a roll pin driver and buggered it up to the point it now can't be driven out. This is a projector press the forerunner of the latest Hornedy progressive press. From looking at the schematic of their new press I don't see any changes in design except for the LNL inserts in the head.

I know that the fella that broke it may have been heavy handed and Lord knows that there are some folks out there that simply can break anything, but from years of loading and working on guns and machines it still doesn't look like the best designed system to me. On the bright side Hornedy did tell me they would fix it free less the cost of the parts damaged by the ham handed fella whom tried to repair it at home.

Considering I have nearly every $32 buck shell plate made for this press (there's a couple of dozen) I may have it repared this summer to use as a progress handgun loader. The fella also used some of the aluminum bars that operate the powder measure for some pieces of aluminum he needed for braces on something. This is quite a story in itself.

Bottom line I would sure buy a Dillon progressive first if I was considering a progressive press. For a single stage I would probably buy the Lee as it makes great ammo and I owned an RCBS Rockchucker for years and still like the little Lee. The new Lee cast iron Classic four hole turret press is the one I'd put on the bench if I were buying a new press today and only had room for one. It would allow me to have all my dies set up and ready in a ten buck turret that just pops into the press in seconds.

The LNL AP press also upgraded the Projector/Pro-7's toggle/pawls, primer feed, powder measure/linkage, cartridge ejection, subplate and shell plates, and they removed the roll pins and added a case feeder. About the only thing that hasn't changed is the paint color.

Check your facts before spreading FUD about the LNL AP progressive press.

Your right BigJake the roll pins are gone. Now all the rotational force the press delivers from the driveshaft (item number 30 part number 391256) ti the drive hub (item number 29 part number 392355) which imparts all the turning force to the shell holder plate is now handled by a 1/8 inch by 1/2 inch pin (item number 34 part number 392306). This according to Hornedy's schematics. I know this press works, but still don't think it's an engineering marvel. Everyone has an opinion, but I really don't think I'm spreading FUD.

Hornedy does have a great warrentee program and had no problem telling me to send in the projector press I have to be repaired or replaced.

Like I said before I wouldn't doubt that it took some real ham handedness to break the press I have and even more to try to fix it when it has such a good warrentee. Sometimes folks do some strange stuff though.

I'll still stick to my advice for a progressive press to the Dillon. But everybody has their favorites. If it works for you that's great.

. . . Bottom line, much like with women, pretty stuff is nice but it always costs a lot more and works no better. . . Or am I missing something????
IMO, Bad example to pick. Opens up a whole can of worms and sounds sexist.;)

Bob - " I don't think your missing anything, but it does make die changing easier. This may just be a gimmick or it may be a boon to the reloader, time will tell. "

Thanks for the confirmation. I haven't used any such quick-change system but since I can exchange a die in my RC 2 in about 12 seconds - I've timed it - and a typical loading session lasts maybe two hours, I just don't see the time saved as meaningful.

My old turret press usually sits beneith my bench, came to feel that the disadvantage of press spring - there has to be some slop or the turret couldn't turn - out weigh the advantages of rapid die swaps. If I had to buy a new press tomorrow it would be the Lee Classic Cast single stage.

I usually oil my dies, inside and out, with an aerosol oil after each session and clean them completely before reuse so leaving dies in a swappable turret wouldn't do much for me. But, to each his own... (I think it's a gimmick! :) )

Sexist? ME? Okay, my once good looking (gravity and time are our enemy!) but still excellant wife and three grown daughters will confirm that I AM NOT and never have been PC! :D

"Check your facts before spreading FUD about the LNL AP"

I believe Bob's data was correct for the press he was addressing. No one can keep up with the continued/constant revisions and re-engineering of everything on the market.

. . . gravity and time are our enemy! . . . :D
Know all about gravity and time. Been there, done that!:D

Keep in mind that the Lee Turret and other turret presses are related only by the fact that their die heads can be rotated. I bought my first cast iron turret press over thirty five years ago and used them quite a bit. Once I used the first Lee turret to hit the market, all my other turrets were disposed of.

Press spring is an issue with the old center-rotating turrets with no outer rim support because they are basically a "C" press, and don't flex coaxially with the ram thrust. It should be clarified that the Hornady press inquired about in the OP is basically and "O" press and not subject to that particular failing.

nick brings up a good point. And as much as it looks like I put down the Hornedy press folks are out there using it and loading good ammo. The changes in the new Hornedy press I'm sure were brought about by problems that happened to the older press.

I wasn't impressed by the engineering in the turning systems of both the old Hornedy Projector or the new LNL AP press. I guess after you spend near 50 years reloading and have seen so many presses come and go in the market place that can happen. Simply because I'm not impressed with the engineering doesn't make it a bad press.

I guess the interesting thing to look at are all the discontinued presses by existing manufacturers. The following presses were introduced to the public with great fanfare and rave reviews by eager recipients of free samples: RCBS A-4, RCBS Junior, Reloader, Reloader 2, Reloader 3, Reloader 4, Green Machine and Big Max from RCBS and all are no longer in production. Dillon's discontinued list includes the 350, 350 A, 350 B, 450, 450 A, 450 B, 450 JR, 550, 550 A, RL 1000 and the original Square Deal.

There are many other discontinued models from press manufactures. Point is all these presses worked, but they were not what users wanted.

Faucett, I don't guess that we need to bring up things like my Lyman All American, Spartan and Spar-T or my aluminum Midway O, P-W 200 or Cougar & Hunter, huh? At least I got rid of my Herters, Pacifics and Texans.

I've got a couple of old friends whom are still making ammo on a couple of those old Herters presses. Boy were they built sturdy. I sure havn't seen a Pacific or a Texan for a while though. I loaded a lot of years on an old C&H before I went to RCBS, then finally for years on a Rockchucker.

Back some years ago I found myself down in Phoenix Arizona teaching truck driving school for Swift. I wanted to do some shooting and all my loading equipment was up in Idaho in storage. I decided that I would spend 69 bucks and get the Lee Anniversary kit. At that time it came with a manual and everything but a set of dies. I thought for that price I could use it til I got my "good" stuff from Idaho. Well the ammo I loaded was as good as I could make on anything and that cheap Lee Aluminum and plastic stuff is still on the bench and the Rockchucker is long gone in a yard sale.

I sure have to agree with Ranger, I can't see any difference in the ammo made on about any of the presses on the market. I was looking at some of the presses Corbon sells for both bullet swaging and reloading and they are fantastic machines, but I really don't believe that they will make any more accurate ammo than I'm making right now on that 69 buck outfit that's on my bench.

There's always the argument that well made equipment is a reason in itself to own something and that holds true with lots of things. I know that there is a pleasure in owning, handling and shooting a well made gun. I really like taking the Ruger #1 out and it's a pleasure to shoot, but a NEF single shot will still get bullets down range just the same.

The point is I doubt that with any modern reloading equipment you'd find a difference in the ammo it makes barring something that is mis-machined as the first poster here ran across.

I will allow that most presses will turn out good ammo. I'm a Hornady fan and have the L-N-L progressive and single stage presses. Bought with the free bullet deal and they were less than 1/2 price for the single stage. The quick change bushings do have a draw back. There is some movement of the dies under load because they use an 'O' ring to hold them in place. The bushing has to be tight, with pliers/wrench, to eliminate this. Found that my Dillon case trimmer couldn't be used in the bushing because of this, there was too much play at top of the stroke to get a consistant lenght on the case. I still like them, Hornady are built to last.

The progressive has been trouble free for 5-6 years of constant use.

I have a Lyman Spatan that I bought when I was 15, 39 years ago, that is still useful. Use a Forster Co-Ax for the bench rest stuff.

"Check your facts before spreading FUD about the LNL AP"

I believe Bob's data was correct for the press he was addressing. No one can keep up with the continued/constant revisions and re-engineering of everything on the market.

Maybe I misread this quote from Bob:

From looking at the schematic of their new press I don't see any changes in design except for the LNL inserts in the head.

Since the LNL AP is the only model that has LNL inserts, I assumed he was saying that nothing else had changed between his Projector model and the LNL AP, which, as I pointed out, is patently false.

If I misread that, or if that was not Bob's intention, I sincerely apologize.

As for the use of an eighth inch pin to rotate the shell plate, I believe the engineering term for it would be a "shear pin": one that is designed to break (in the case of a mishap) before something more expensive breaks. If something is holding up the shell plate enough to shear that pin, I'd very much prefer the pin to break than something more expensive. Even with free replacement parts, that cuts down on warranty service costs at Hornady, which cuts down on the purchase price for us. Given the lack of reports of users breaking that pin, I would say it is adequately strong in that application for normal use by normal users.

Hornady actually delivered a batch of presses with faulty shell plate hubs which did break before the pin did during mishaps. They tracked the problem to the manufacturer of the hub, and solved the problem. Even a well designed shear pin won't solve all problems.

However, the use of a spring pin in a shear pin application in the Projector and earlier press versions was poor engineering.

Andy

Interesting about the defective plates. I can't imagine anyone intending a roll pin to serve as a shear pin, though. They are hardened spring steel, and you don't want something harder than the material it is mounted in to serve as a shear pin, even if it is weak enough to snap off in an emergency. Shear pins, like key stock for pulley shafts, are something on the softer side so the metal they protect will cut into them without its edges getting battered or dulled. Sounds like the newer design is a shear pin, though. LNL (live and learn) is in engineering everywhere.

Well I decided to go with the AP. The Dillon RL 550 B was my second choice and the Lee Loadmaster was considered. It appears to be a well made press, it does NOT have a removable turret that is going to move under pressure and has five stations rather than four. I'm not sure of the L-N-L bushings but from what I've read if they are tightened a little extra with a wrench they are rock solid. If not, I didn't see any reason they couldn't be permanently attached by a good fabricating specialist, it would just make change over time a bit longer, but that's doesn't concern me.

Now you've got to let us know how it works for you kglo. Did you get the 500 bullets with it? I wouldn't permanently attach dies to your press, your going to want to load other than one caliber down the road and I think you'll find it will make adequate ammo the way it comes.

Even though I griped some on the older model they load good ammo. I really don't think there is a bad press on the market today. Consumers have really sorted out what works and doesn't today.

I'd sure give it a good try before I started modifying it and consider that if you do modify it your lifetime warrentee goes down the drain. Good luck with your loading, I've been stuffing cases now for near 50 years and it's sure saved me a bunch of bucks besides giving me ammo custom tailored for my guns.

Actually the L-N-L bushing is what would be permanently attached(if absolutely necessary). What that would accomplish is it would make the press accept a standard 7/8" 14 thread. The idea of the L-N-L system is you can leave the bushing on the die and leave it set even when removed because the the bushing screwed onto the die stays on the die and the bushing cams into the press for a "super fast die change" I do plan on using it the way it's designed, from everything I've read once the bushing is locked into the press if you give it a light torque with a wrench it locks up rock solid.

I will post up when it's up and loading, however some of the accessories I ordered are back ordered so I'm not sure of when it will come in:(

Oh, and yes the 1,000 free bullets helped persuade the wife into the additional funding.:D

How is that case feeder anyway? I've been eyeballing one for a while now. I have had my Hornady LNL for 5 years now, zero probelms with it. Before it I had a Lyman Orange Crush.

Have had the case feeder for a bit over 2 years now and it works like a charm. Really speeds up the rate you can churn out ammo.
Although I purchased all 4 plates I find myself never using the large rifle plate as I rarely load rifle-aside from the 223- on the LnL. I really prefer to use the Forster press for my bench rest stuff.
Case feeder easy to set up and nary a hiccup since installing it.
I'd say that if you load a lot of pistol cartridges, go for it.

Gary

The big brown truck dropped off a big brown box today and inside is my new Hornady AP:D. I haven't had a chance to do much with it yet, but tomorrow I should have it setup and loading.

It's setup and loading S&W500's and doing a great job. I had some problems getting it going but the biggest one was my fault, while setting up the auto powder drop I dumped powder into the priming assembly and plugged it all up, so it had to be taken back apart and thoroughly cleaned.
The the powls were not timed quite right but I had read that even though Hornady claims they are adjusted at the factory and should be ready upon set up they are often not. The only thing I was a little disappointed by was the metal bracket that holds the bin that catches the loaded rounds was not formed all the way and didn't fit very well to the side of the press, but that was solved today with a bit of reforming and trimming.

All in all, with a bit of tweaking, I'm quite pleased with the Hornady AP.