I have an older mec 600 jr. The only indicators on the 2 bars I have is an O and a OH. I can't find info from MEC's web. Anyone know what charge these will give?

I would not bother with them. The fixed charge bars were a pain. Get a new bar that uses bushings. You could drill the old bars out to accept bushings. It is a two step process as you have to make a second cut for the bushing flange.

How could they be a pain if they are for the charge you want? There is nothing there to malfunction

The problem is they are not always the charge you want. The new bars don't malfunction. There is nothing to malfunction. I would have sent you some of the old bars had I known anyone liked them. I threw away 8 of them. You should weigh your powder drops as the weight can vary from one jug to another.

Thanks old tymer, I haven't reloaded in a while. I think the bars were for 1 1/8 oz shot and 18.5 gr red dot but I couldn't remember. I just came across a huge deal at a yard sale for 15 bags of shot for 5$ a bag. That was incentive to start reloading again. I also got a hornady apex progressive loader, but what I've read about them is not to favorable. Any exp. with these loaders?

That was a great buy on shot. I don't have any experience with the Apex but some one else will probably come along that does. You might want to ask on the Shotgun World site. This link will get you there. Ask in the reloading section.
http://www.shotgunworld.com/bbs/index.php

Measure the diameter of the openings--shot and powder. I can probably tell what the shot ozs it will dispense and an approximate powder charge by doing some reverse engineering. I have taken all my old shot bars and remanufactured them into the new style with powder bushing and the insert in the shot column with view hole for powder bushing number. Although I have seen some crude attempts to drill them to accept the powder bushings none have met with much success. I bore mine out on a milling machine as well as mill for the shot insert. The down side of this is you loose any anodizing done to the bars where ever you mill. 1 1/8 oz shot = .640" Dia give or take a couple thousands inch. If its a "12 Ga 0" bar the powder dia. (.454") is very close to a #32 MEC bushing.

The 0 and the 0H bars are both for 1 1/8 ounces of shot.
<O:p</O:p
0H:
2 ¾ DE, 15.5 Grains 700X
2 ¾ DE, 21.5 Grains Unique
<O:p</O:p

0:
2 ¾ DE, 21 Grains PB
2 ¾ DE, 25.5 Grains SR7625
3 DE, 18.5 Grains Red Dot
3 DE, 18.5 Grains Green Dot
3 DE, 20 Grains 700X
<O:p</O:p

There were a couple of other loadings for the 0H, but those powders are no longer available.
<O:p</O:p

DC

tnfiddler,

The "OH" bar is for 2 3/4 dram equiv., 1 1/8 ounce loads with the following powders:
22.8 gr. Win473
17.5 gr. Hi Skor 700X
21.5 gr. Unique

The "O" bar is for 3 dram equiv., 1 1/8 ounce loads with the following powders:
18.5 gr. Red-Green Dot
21 gr. Dupont PB (2 3/4 DE load)

All of the above loads are noted to be with a "plastic unit", and at the bottom of the page it is noted that these are " Power Piston, AA, Flite-Max, Vari, etc." At the time this data was printed they were treating all plastic unit wads as being equivalent to one another.

This data was taken from the old MEC sheet, and you use it at your own risk. I personally think the recommendation to get new bars for the replaceable powder bushing is the smartest way to go.

I was researching and typing at the same time as DMC, and didn't see his reply until I posted. His 20 grain load of 700X is noted for fiber wads, not plastic unit wads. I found 3 sheets from MEC in my souvenirs listing this data. Some of it included powder no longer available and several loads were for fiber wads. If you decide to use the bar, check the data against current recipes. There may be significant differences.

Thanks for the info guys. A couple more questions, what powder is the best value for the money? Also I don't understand the grains to drams conversion. When I google for the conversion charts they say 3 drams is 82 grains, but when it comes to the info on shell boxes they are all close to 3 drams. What am I missing?

"Drams equivalent to black powder" Your 3 Dram load has enough smokeless powder behind it to equal the velocity of a load of 3 drams of black powder. It's a holdover from days gone by. This could be as little as 15 grains of smokeless powder, depending on shot weight and a few less influential factors. An equal weight substitution of smokeless for black puts you into maximum overload territory, maybe beyond. :eek:

Red Dot or 700-X are pretty economical for target loads. Red Dot is a bit fluffier or less dense than 700-X, which sometimes means using a different wad. In any case, you have to check those powder bars with a good powder scale. The charts are only an approximation, not gospel.

Bye
Jack

I'm sorry, I think in Dram Equivalent (DE), it's second nature to me. It is a measure of velocity, not the powder charge.

A 2 3/4 Dram Equivalent 1 1/8 ounce load has a muzzle velocity of 1,145 FPS. A 3 DE load has a MV of 1,200 FPS. 3 1/4 DE is 1,255 FPS.

Looking at a (12 Gauge) Field load, 1 1/4 ounces of shot, 3 1/4 DE will give a MV of 1,220 FPS.

Guess you gotta be raised up thinking that way or it won't make much sense.

DC

tnfiddler,
You absolutely need to get up-to-date loading data before you use those bars for reloading. The on-line data on Alliant and Hodgdon websites are a good place to start. Lyman's Shotshell Handbook, 5th Edition is the best printed data. If the powder drops that those bars will give fits into any of the listed modern recipes, then you are good to go. MEC's old data did not specify any particular hull, wad or primer. These all have a profound effect on the pressure of any load you put together.

Thanks again, I get it now about the drams Eq. I'm going to drop a few charges with the bars I have and weigh them. Dad found his old MEC data sheet that lists the specific loads for these bars. I will see how close these are. I will let you know what the outcome is

I weighed the charges today that the O bar throws. 3 times charging the powder (red dot) the result was 16.97gr, 16.97gr, and 17.74gr. The shot charge was 1.07 oz.and 1.05 oz.of # 7. 1/2 The variation in the last powder recorded must be the speed at which the bar is pushed. That must have an effect. Am I right? Would you get the same variation with a bushing in the bar?

Consistency counts in getting a uniform charge. I've also found that flake powders take a while to settle down, or orient themselves to the flow. The other thing is that you settle the powder a bit every time you cycle the handle, which is 5 times per shell. I'd expect you'll find it's dropping close to 18 grains on a steady run. Bushings will give you the same results. At any rate it's a fairly light load and a good place to start. Check out the Alliant data for a shell + wad combination that fits with your powder and shot.

http://www.alliantpowder.com/

Bye
Jack