Well there is something odd about Hodgdon Lil Gun data and the Hornet.

13.0 grains and 35 VMax Hdy is suppose to give 24000CUP in my M6 is a slightly over max load that can cause sticking and base expansion 3/10,000ths over factory loads

13.0 grains and 45 Hornady is suppose to give 31600 CUP in my M6 is a gross overload needing to be hammered out by a brass rod and giving base expansion 20/10,000ths over factory loads...YES 2/1000ths

10.2 grains of Lil Gun gives maximum expansion with 45 grain X's..still won't stabalize them.

Maybe when something seems to good to be true, it is.

You didn't get some of the HOT lot, by chance?
http://www.hodgdon.com/news/lilgunrecall.php

Bye
Jack

You didn't get some of the HOT lot, by chance?
http://www.hodgdon.com/news/lilgunrecall.php

Bye
Jack

Thanks.. nope my lot is 1 07270223... but it sure doesn't work as advertised.

Interestingly the Barnes data is close to what my rifle does. Think I'll stick to 4227.

The 13.0 grains of Li'l Gun, 35 grain V-Max and a BR4 primer in W-W cases work just great in my Ruger 77/22. My M-6 Springfield Armoy has yet to get them, as I have several hundred soft points and hollow points loaded which go through the M-6. All of them have been loaded with H110, my favorite Hornet powder.

As I've stated on other forums, I think there is more than the powder at play here....

As I've stated on other forums, I think there is more than the powder at play here....


Hobie: please let me know what you mean.

I tried a few loads with Lil Gun in my K Hornet. I observed surpisingly high pressure signs and stopped.
Even 13 grains of Lil Gun does not fill the K Hornet case. I wonder if that has a bearing on the problem.

Today, I worked up a few loads with H-110. The maximum load I tried was 13 grains.
Pressure at that load seems quite acceptable.

I have not chronographed the load yet. I need a battery for my chronograph. As soon as I get a chance, I will report my findings.

I have tried W-296 as well as Lil Gun powder with similar pressure problems.

In my gun, those powders do not work.

I think that H-110 is much more suitable. I hope that accuracy is also acceptable.

I just recently purchased a ruger 77/22 hornet and picked up a pound of Lil Gun along with 35 v-max, 40 gr. v-max, 45 gr. hornady sp. and 45 gr. rem hp's. Are ya'll suggesting I trash the lil-gun and buy h-4227 instead. I am in the process of working a load. Suggestions...please! What has worked best for you...I intend to varmint up to coyotes. Please include all components; primers, OAL, etc. I will need the cartridges to fit the clip though. Thanks!

H4227 never gives M6 Scout extraction problems even at top loads. Lil gun gives extraction problems most of the time.

The M6 Scout is a fine little rig but it has poor extraction. I am unsure what my experience with Lil Gun means. the extraction problems could mean pressure but I also get extraction problems with low speed low pressure pellet loads driven by the primer only at 350 ft/sec.

I'd certainly give it a try in a bolt gun but start low even though the listed pressure seems to suggest you can jump to max.

I have not been able to load Lil Gun over 10.5 gr. without seeing pressure problems. (K-Hornet)

I have loaded 12 gr. of 4227 for years with no problems, but was not happy with velocity. (around 2650-2700)

Reports on Lil Gun indicated much better performance. This has not materialized for me.

Perhaps my container of Lil Gun came from a hot lot.

I am hoping to see much better velocities using H-110

Mark Hinson -

I've also a Ruger 77/22 in .22 Hornet and the 13.0 gr of Li'l Gun and a 35 gr Hornady V-Max with CCI BR4 primer work just fine in it. Shoots .690 - .750 MOA on days I do my part.

Go right ahead and use it - you'll like it!

Thanks for the response. Do you take varmints with this load? What range and performance can I expect if so? What OAL do you set 'cause I'll need to clip feed for quick shots? Thanks again!

Only used this load to kill paper targets so far. The V-Max load has OAL of 1.700" and they function fine thru the rotary magazine. You should be able to use this loading to normal Hornet ranges - 250 yd max for average conditions.

Well there is something odd about Hodgdon Lil Gun data and the Hornet.

13.0 grains and 35 VMax Hdy is suppose to give 24000CUP in my M6 is a slightly over max load that can cause sticking and base expansion 3/10,000ths over factory loads

13.0 grains and 45 Hornady is suppose to give 31600 CUP in my M6 is a gross overload needing to be hammered out by a brass rod and giving base expansion 20/10,000ths over factory loads...YES 2/1000ths

10.2 grains of Lil Gun gives maximum expansion with 45 grain X's..still won't stabalize them.

Maybe when something seems to good to be true, it is.

Hey, I got one of the CZ made M6's in the parkerised finish and I agree that these things are probably amongst the best value for money rifles that I have run into. Very accurate, light etc great for carrying around up in the hills and gorges where I live in the North West of Western Australia. I was reading in the Speer reloading info that they have found CCI
standard small pistol primers to be the best for lil gun and others. They go on to say that using small rifle primers will result in high pressures. Hope this helps. I'm going to start reloading for my M6 Hornet as soon as I get enough brass. The **** thing is so accurate I have not wasted any bullets so still do not have 100 brass yet lol. The only thing is that I found the little bit of movement I have between stock and action, barrels etc to be a little unnerving. Still shoots ok tho. I'm wondering if yours also has a little movement at the connecting pin of the break action. Please let me know of any further experiments in reloading you have. I'll be keen to learn from your experience.

Regards
Kaneyang.

Hey Kanyeyang:

Nice to hear from down under. Yes I too have a bit of side to side motion between barrel and stock assembly. I decided not to worry about it as the gun shoots about as well as I can with peeps. Relieved to hear that this is just the way they are and I don't have a lemon.

The extractors don't have a lot of power and this does lead to problems with reloads. I get case sticking with low and high pressure loads. For example the rifle shoots well with 22 pellets and primers. The velocity is 350ft/sec and shoots pretty good groups at 50 feet. About every 3rd shot won't extract. A load of 45 Hornady's and RL7 that gives 1400ft/sec and limited base expansion won't extract about every 3rd shot either.

I carry a little brass rod that slides down the bore and strikes the case loose.

Still can't figure out my little gun experience but I have had excellent predictable results with IMR 4227, H4227 and H4198. The extra velocity isn't that neccessary as
the explosive effect wrecks too much meat. I am more interested in finding a 60 grain RN or FN short enough to stabalize at 2000ft/sec.

Yes 60gn projectiles have my attention too. If I find any I'll let ya know. I reckon a trip to a good gunsmith may help with the extractor. They are renowned for their weak extractor though, from what I have read. I'd be interested in what game you are hunting up there. Oh, I found having a shotshell in the breech makes stock wiggle almost non existent. Lets keep each other posted on reloading for this little beauty!
Kaneyang

Kaneyang

I have been hunting mostly grouse and rabbits. The Hornet is too explosive in it's factory guise. The 50 grain Sierra Semispitzers at 21-2200ft/sec is a much better game load than factory. It seems hunters of today want to explode non edible game rather than cleanly kill eatable stuff.

I have used a 223 to take a fair number of caribou and I think the 22 Hornet with a 60 grain RN at 2000 would work o.k. with a good shot to 100 yards or so. I know the 50 SSP would be o.k too. I am using this as my snowshoe/toboggan gun and if I get the chance on an unsuspecting caribou at close range I'll try it.

My rifle still wobbles with the shot shell inserted but it shoots like a champ.

I hate to admit it but I found a Savage 24C in 22LR and 20 gauge that has stolen all my time. It's been a sweet outfit too and handles slugs much better than the M6. I am getting 3" groups at 50 yards and 5" at 80 with 3/4 oz. Win slugs. It has an equal but different charm as compared to the M6. The 22LR shoots about 3 times more accurately than with slugs and shot loads really cover at 20-25 yards.

Of course the Hornet is much more than the LR and the stainless light weight package means that the M6 still has a place in my cabinet.

Hey North,
Yes, I was intested in the savage combo gun. Used one as a kid to whistle hunt foxes. Borrowed gun was a bit of a clanger due to it's ill treatment by the owner on whose farm I was shooting. Still an excellent little gun. The 20G is superior to the 410 of course. I have been using my M6 to hunt hill and plains kangaroo, Australian Bustard and a monitor lizard we have here that is good eating. The little 410 is just right in number 6 shot for the lizard (goanna or bungarra it's called). The Hornet would no doubt perform on larger game I am sure as a one old bloke uses his out here to head shoot feral donkey. I agree with you about too much expansion for factory loads on smaller game although the hornet performs well on heart lung shots on larger kangaroo no problems with 45gn Winchester factory loads. I was thinking about Sierra 50gn Semi Spitzers but thought they might be a little 'explody' too. I'll give them a go and see how they work.

Regards,
Kaneyang

Baker -

My bet is that when you chronograph your Lil Gun loads, the velocity will be up there even with 10 grs. Same for the 296 and H110 loads. You have a tight bbl or throat.