Need advice on 30-06 loads. My son has a Rem. 710 and I have a Rem. 700 both 30-06. We both like to shoot 180 grain Core Locks from Rem. The 710 is dead on at 100 yds, but 5 to 6 inches high at 150 yds. Anyone have advice on a different brand of ammo, would like to stay in the 180 grain class.

Thanks
TTX42

What kind of scope mounts do you have on the 710? This is almost a ballistic impossibility for the bullet to 5-6 high at 150 yards, yet dead on at 100 yards. I've tried several scenarios on my ballistic software and cannot duplicate this.

You and I may both learn something of value here.

kciH, As you prob know the 710 came with a Bushnell 3x9, there are no indications on the bases as to what brand. I assume that they are Bushnell. I believe the problem to be that this particular rifle is not going to shoot Rem 180 grain core locks very well. I hope to be able to try Federal 180's today to see how it handles them. If you have any advice, please send it my way.
Thanks
TTX42

Doesn't matter what brand of rings/bases, the key question is how high is the centerline of the scope from the centerline of the bore. Very high rings can do odd things to the trajectory.

If you have a typical scope with a 40mm objective, and there is say less than a quarter inch between the bottom of the scope objective (the objective is the big lens on the front of the scope) and the barrel, then the rings are probably not all that high. If there is an inch between the bottom of the scope and the barrel, that is really quite a lot.

Another possible reason for the odd point of impact at 150 yards is parallax in the scope. Unless your scope has an adjustable objective, there will only be one range that the scope is pefectly focused at. At other ranges, if your eye is not lined up perfectly in the same spot each time, then it's like having your rear sight moved a little when you are shooting open sights. But that should not account for more than perhaps an inch or two at normal hunting ranges. Generally speaking, scopes for big game rifles are set to be parallax-free at around 150 yards. If you have the rifle on sandbags and you aren't touching it, does moving your head a little seem to shift the crosshairs on the target? If so this is parallax.

I don't believe that another brand of ammo is necessarily going to solve the problem. Normally you would see a drop in the point of impact at 150 yards if sighted in at 100 yards.

In addition to all the above (and, I agree with the high scope mounting doing odd things to points-of-impact) you might consider a little lighter bullet, although you expressly want to use 180 grainers. Most rifles today that are chambered for the 30-06 cartridge will have a 1:10 twist rate, which stabilizes the 150 - 165 grain bullets much better than the 180 grainers.

If you want to shoot factory loaded ammo only, I can highly recommend the Hornady Lite Magnum line of ammunition. I'm hard pressed to duplicate their velocity and accuracy in my two 30-06's with handloads. Give them a try - think you'll like'um!!

A quick check with the ballistics calculator shows it would take a scope mounted SIXTEEN INCES above the bore to cause a bullet to strike six inches high at 150yds when zeroed at 100. Obviously that is not the case, so I conclude we are working with bad data.

There are one of two (or more) things going on here. Either the point of impact is shifting - due to a bedding problem, loose scope mounts, etc. - or we are looking at data for one shot at each range, since it is physically impossible for the rifle to shoot 6" high at 150 while properly zeroed at 100.

If you answer one question, we can work on solving this, step by step -

What is the group size (at LEAST three shots, WITHOUT adjusting the scope) at 100 yards?

Answer that question first and we'll move forward with diagnosing the problem. Don't worry about point of impact at this point. I am only asking about precision, not accuracy right now. Once we determine how precise the rifle is, then we can address point of impact.

IDShooter,
It is grouping between 1.5 and 1.75 at 100 yds. In response to the other postings, there is approximately 3/8 inch between the front objective of the scope and the barrel. To give you more information, it has a BSA Contender 4x16 x 40 on it.
As for as a base being loose, I don't beleive this to be the case. It is on in regards to windage (left to right), and does not vary much in grouping. All groups are high at 150 yds and do not vary. I would think that if there was a loose base or a problem in bedding that the high group would not be consistent as in an eratic grouping.

Thanks for your input,

TTX42

Are you using the same shooting technique at the different ranges? A rifle that is zeroed at 100 yards off a bench rest or sandbags on a bench can signifigantly change point of impact if the barrel, instead of the forearm, is rested on something unforgiving at the same range. Sling pressure on the forend can do different things if a sling is being used. I've never seen a case where the above factors influenced point of aim the great degree you are talking about though. Was the difference observed on the same outing with the same ammo from the same box of the same ammo?

kciH,
This gun was shot from a vice and from sand bags, using ammo from the same box. This was all done on the same day. I also shot the gun myself after my son shot it. Same results.

TTX42

It's beyond me. Seems to defy the laws of physics. What happens if you zero in at 150 yds?

Change your scope. Check your base mount screws and put a different scope on. Start from square one and see what happens.

Wait a sec - you said the gun was shot from a vice and from sand bags. Did the groups from the vice print lower than the groups from the sandbags, by any chance? If you sighted at 100yds with the gun in a vice, then shot at 150 yds from sandbags, THAT could make a difference in your point of impact. Sorry if we're throwing out things you've already thought of, but I can't come up with much else!

In any case, if you are already getting 1.5" groups, a change in ammo is not going to make much difference at 150yds. If you just want to try some handloads, I like a 180gr Hornady SP or Nosler Partition with H4350. The Hodgdon website has data at http://www.hodgdon.com .

Good luck!

Hmmm..... something strange.

Ok, here's what I would do to check the scope & bases & rings:

Shoot 1 5-shot group at each range (100 and 150 yards). But shoot first 1 target, then the other. So your shots alternate at the different ranges. Same shooter each time, same hold on the gun, same rest, same ammo.

Of course the barrel is going to get hot so take it easy, stop every couple of shots and let it cool down.

Likely you'll have the answer in the first few shots but keep in mind that sometimes it takes a larger group to accurately determine the 'real' group center.

I would think it's has scope mounts loose- I shot mine loose this year while shooting 180 gr loads. Never broke loose until I started shooting the 180s, had hundreds of 150-165s through it before hand, shot 20 180;s and it came loose. Didn't even know it until I got home and started cleaning it. Now those 180's print some nice groups, 1" at 100yds I was about to give up on them. :D

Does the gun have open sights? If so....remove the scope and shoot via open sights. See what happens.