I gotta ask. I bought a Vaquero and finally got the chance to shoot Sunday. It shot low and left. I read the box and they are supposed to be on at 25yds. I was shooting at 50ft. Any ideas? I shot my buddies Kimber 45 and it was dead on. How much of the blade are you supposed to stick over the rear notch? Is there a different way to shooting a revolver than a semi? I'm very dissapointed! Thinking about trading or sending back to Ruger. Please advise.
Thanks,

3Crows

Hi,

How much low and left? Low is easy, you can file down the front sight a little. Left might be the gun, and it might be you. Have a few other people shoot it as well, try one hand hold vs. two hand hold, etc.

When you get the left-right figured out, if it's still off, then have a gunsmith turn the barrel in the frame a smidge. This is a common cure for fix-sighted single actions.

Note that you will get a different point of impact with different ammo. So shoot it for a while and decide what load you are really going to stick with before making any modifications.

I'll shoot it again. Ruger literature said factory fired and on target at 25yd. Shot Winchester loads. Yeah i hear you but for close to $400 you'd think Ruger would get it right. I shoulda known. I had a problem when I got it home and was familarizing myself with the takedown procedure The cylinder slide got stuck and I had to take it back to Dances to fix.
I'm a fairly decent shot. The drift was 4-6" to the left at 50', drop was 3-4"? I will modify my shooting and carry targets to store with me!!
3 Crows

Your grip on the pistol can make a real difference on the point of impact, and as the Vaquero grip is quite different from the 1911 grip, what is working for one may not work on the other. You can find "The Wheel of Misfortune" by clicking on "Error Analysis and Correction" here.
http://www.bullseyepistol.com/

Or go directly to the wheel from here.
http://ourworld.compuserve.com/homepages/Dreyer_infonet/training.htm

There's much more on pistol marksmanship on the first link.

I find that I push the shot left if I get too much finger on the trigger, and have to remind myself to use the tip of my finger instead of the second pad. A tip from Brian Enos' site is "Watch Your Rise". The rapid fire shooter should grip his/her gun so the barrel rises straight up under recoil, as it's easier to pull the front sight down into the notch than if the barrel swings to the left or right as it rises. While this may seem irrelevant to single action slow fire, an inconsistent rise indicates an inconsistent grip.
http://www.brianenos.com/pages/home.html
http://brianenos.ibforums.com/index.php?showtopic=9932
I don't spend enough time there.

Bye
Jack

RE the errors mentioned above, shoot it left handed and see if it prints in the same place. If it does, it's the gun, and not you.
Many Vaqueros shoot low and left. The only real solution is to have the barrel turned to correct the error.Both mine have the front site visibly tilted to the right.
Here's a group from my 4 5/8 44. I shot the 10 shot one hole group, after I settled down, at 50 ft.
http://home.pcisys.net/~dandunphy/graphic/Vaq_group.jpg
A heavier bullet or a lighter load will bring the groups up, or once you settle on a load, you can file the front site.
Many 44-40 and .45 Rugers have undersized chamber mouths. The 44s seem to be generally ok. If it won't shoot a group, fix this first. Slug the barrel and chambermouths. The chamber mouths should be at least .001 bigger than the groove diameter of the barrel. They may shoot ok with jacketed bullets, or very hard cast, like lasercast, even with small chamber mouths. There are a couple of people on the Ruger Forum that will ream your chamber mouths. You send the cylinder rather than the whole gun.
Humpty

I'm with 3 Crows...seems like a raw deal to have to modify a new gun just to get it to shoot where you aim it!!!! Turn the barrel??? Ream undersized chamber mouths??? Isn't that what Ruger was supposed to take care of before the gun left the factory!!!!???

I've been looking at a Vaquero .45, but if not shooting to point of aim (or at least within an inch or two) is a common trend with Vaqueros, I may reconsider...

I've been looking at a Vaquero .45, but if not shooting to point of aim (or at least within an inch or two) is a common trend with Vaqueros, I may reconsider...

I have three .44mag Vaqueros and two .45LC Vaqueros and all five of them shoot low and to the left. I've switched hands and used bench rest support and came to the conclusion it's the revolvers. As Mike indicated, different loads hit in different places, but I don't want to be dictated as to a specific load so I've switched to adjustable sighted revolvers.

Many folks after using Ruger Blackhawks have come to the conclusion that Ruger makes a good "starters kit".

Dan

Is this a problem with all the fixed sight revolvers? I realize a fixed sight gun will never be as versatile as an adjustable sight gun... But 5"-6" off point of aim seems a bit ridiculous!!!!

Do the Cimmarron guns have the same problems? I've been looking at them also, but was leaning towards Ruger since I could fire heavier loads if I ever needed to...(random encounter w/black bear? :) )

I went out today and shot 250 swc-K w/13.0 blue dot. for 1050 fps. My 44 Vaquero shot 6" low and 3" to the left. I have been trying different loads. but I have the same problem.

None of my shots were low and left from a used Vaquero, .45 LC. The targets were shot indoors at a local range, at 15 yds. and 30 yds. (both measured). The ammo is Magtech cowboy loads of 225 grains. The targets are posted on my website at http://www.geocities.com/rugercal480. They are the first shot with the gun. None are shot from a bench. Mostly with the top of the front sight in the groove, level. Some two handed, some one handed, both right and left. I was pleased with the way the gun shot and handled. I also shoot a Ruger .44 mag SRH/DA, the 480 and a .357 GP-100, a Single Six .22LR/magnum, and a MarkII Government Target. I don't think I have had a Ruger Gun that I disliked at all.

Rugercal 480 - I didn't mean to slam Ruger in general...I have a Mini-14 and a Blackhawk convertible .357/9mm...both are great guns (the Blackhawk is EXTREMELY accurate. Just seems like a lot of folks have trouble with the vaqueros...wish I knew the gun would shoot like yours, i'd be sold then!! :)

Rugercal 480 - I didn't mean to slam Ruger in general...I have a Mini-14 and a Blackhawk convertible .357/9mm...both are great guns (the Blackhawk is EXTREMELY accurate. Just seems like a lot of folks have trouble with the vaqueros...wish I knew the gun would shoot like yours, i'd be sold then!! :)

No problem...the Rugers are "big boys" and can take the heat! ;) Sorry,that you had problems with yours. Won't hurt to check with them to see if anything can be done to improve your gun's performance....uh...and NO, you can't have MY Vaquero!! :D

Thank you for your responses. I bought 2 boxes of ammo at the last show. One box is FMC and the other is Winchester. I looked at the site listed above and found some tuning of the shooter that I'm gonna do. Very interesting circle.
Having shot Semi's with a square grip and picking up a round grip Revolver I found I hold the gun differently. To much finger will push the gun left. But the grip needs to be natural and automatic. I don't need to think about what I'm doing once I've trained my hand. If I can.
Weather' been crappy around here of late. I need to get to the range. As soon as I get my honey-Dew down to Honey-wut I'll try the 2 box's- debrief and evaluate my experience. If I keep the Ruger, send it in for tuning or sell it and get something else I'l let you know. I appreciate all of your input its what makes a site work!!

Well...finally gave in and went with the vaquero. no complaints so far; seems to shoot point-of-aim (at least at close range)

Good luck with your gun 3 Crows...mine seems to be shootin' pretty good!!!! :)

My .357 Blackhawk started out low & left, but after shooting more & finding the right ammo its all better. Usually its not the gun....

Well fella's I gotta tell. It is the shooter. I was swallowing the grip and holding to high. My hand was to far forward and I was pushing to the left. I put 50 rounds down range last night and was very happy. I thank all of you for your help.

Ive got a vaquero with 3 1/2 barrel and tonight put it on paper and the gun will shoot better than i thought. i do believe most of the bad things one hears about them is more the shooter than the gun. i know i need alot more practice

I have two pairs of Ruger vaqueros -- 2 Bisley style w/5-1/2" barrels and 2 Birds Heads w/3-1/2" barrels... All in 45 Colt... I use all for for Cowboy Action Shooting and general all around plinking...

I have experienced a similar problem with the Bisley style grips... I have had to work hard at training my hand to grip the stocks correctly... One of the Bisleys shoots right on target all the time, the other has an issue of shooting slightly left and low... Maybe 2" left and 2-3" low... Since I am not hunting with it or shooting bullseyes I can live with it -- It always rides in my left (weak hand) holster and I compensate for it when I aim... Small inconvenience...

The Birds Heads, on the other hand, seem to shoot exactly to the point of aim...

I load my own ammo since I shoot a lot... The loads my guns seem to work best with are 250/255 grain hard cast lead (RNFP) bullets with a powder (Unique) that pushes them out at about the 900 - 950 fps... I have tried loads that produce 750 to 800 fps, but they all shoot low at 25 yards (maybe 3 to 4 inches)...

I know some shooters like the lighter loads and they file down their front sights to adjust the point of aim... I have a problem mutilating a gun, so I try to find loads that shoot to the guns natural point of aim... If I do shoot a lighter load, I hold the front sight slightly above the top of the rear notch.

I have tried some off the shelf cowboy loads and found them a little too light...

I haven't experienced any of the base pin problems that some vaqueros seem to have, but I did finally swicth them out for Bell Mountain Sheriff base pins in order to increase the reach of the extractor rod... If you shoot your Vaqueros often, you'll appreciate the extended reach... Most times the spent casings literally fall out of the cylinders, but after a long shooting session they do need a little help... Bell Mountain base pins take about 20 minutes or so to fit to your guns, but it is something you can accomplish with some fine grade emery cloth...

Don't give up on the Rugers... they are a **** of gun and they just keep on working... I wouldn't trade mine for anything...

Hope this helps...

I have a vaqu 4 5/8 i shoot alot of target.Fixed sights i dont shoot factory loads they were all over the place.For my ruger i shoot alot so i make my own loads buy hornady bullets 255gr 452dia and use 6 grains of bullseye.This is a cheap way to shoot till the cows come home.This is VERY accurate in my gun. A friend of mine tried this in his 5 1/2 vagu and now thats all he shoots he also had these same problems. Hope this helps

Hi:

Thanks for the information... I understand what you mean about the factory loads... They seem to be loaded too light and always shoot low... I try to keep mine up about 900 fps, which seems to work out okay for me...

I have used both Bullseye and Unique with about equal success... Bulleye is cleaner burning, but Unique (for me) seems to be just a little more accurate--go figure. In fact, I use a load (5.8 grains of Bullseye, under 230gr JRN and 230 TJFP bullets) similar to your load in my .45ACP cartridges...

It seems that the more I read the more "perfect" loads with different powders I see... I have come the the conclusion that Unique, Bullseye and Tite Group are about the only powders I really need for my handgun loads...

Dusty Rider

All the Ruger's I've owned have been real workhorse's and have shot point of aim right out of the box. It did take some instruction and getting used to the fixed sights, and many folks file them down to suit their personal needs, but this may lower the resale value, so don't do it unless you are committed to keeping them. I recently switched from .44 to .45 for CAS, and the new Baretta Stampede I bought was over indexed out of the box, so a buddy let me shoot his .45 Vaquero so I'd have a pair for this past weekend's match. It had non-factory grips, and felt much more like the Colt design, being slimmer and more contured. Although the Ruger is still going to be heavier and more clunky looking the peacemaker design, new grip may make a world of difference for you, and I suggest you handle one with the slimmer grips.

I'm new here but figured this was as good a place to jump in as any.
I have a friend that has a Vaquero and he doesn't like it because it doesn't shoot where he wants it to. He shot about half a box out of it the day we went and got it and he hasn't shot it since. I told him that I would buy it from him and he said he would trade it to me but hasn't figured out what he's wanting to trade for yet...lol.
I bought an 1858 Remington cap&ball revolver replica quite a while back and my two hunting/shooting buddies can't hit with it at all but I can, so I guess it's mostly in the grip and load combo. With light loads it shoots off but with full charge loads it hits to POA for me. It most definitely takes a different grip/hold than my autos or my DA revolvers!
Hope some of that made at least a little bit of sense. :confused: ;)

I recently made two changes to my bisley vaqueros that some of you may be interested in knowing about...

First, I swapped out the original wood stocks for synthetic stag horn stocks... They have just the slightest contour to them that fits my hands better...

The other improvement I made to them was to switch out the factory trigger and hammer for the Powers drop-in 'action-job'. I was a bit skeptical about how much difference the new action would make, but it is like night and day! There is virtually no play when the hammer is a rest and no play when it's at full cock. Talk about a silky smooth action!

I must admit that I am a bit uncomfortable with the lighter trigger pull -- they say it's about 2-1/2 lbs... but, there is almost no travel... When the hammer is cocked the trigger is just at the point of releasing the sear. It's not quite a hair trigger, but it's close. On the up side, since there is very little travel the accuracy of the guns has improved as there is no time to "pull" or "push" the guns as the trigger is squeezed.

The new action also has a half-cock notch that lets it function similar to a Colt SAA.

The factory bisley trigger is much more rounded than the standard vaquero trigger -- I like the standard trigger better than the bisley... I purchased the Power action with the bisley hammer and the standard trigger...

If you can afford to make the improvement, it is definitely worth it... You can install the action yourself if you are moderately mechanically inclined... You need properly sized screw drivers, a good fine file, a good caliper, a set of drift pins and large dose patience... The factory transfer bar needs to be slightly modifed with the file -- or you can purchase a replacement transfer bar that will drop right in...

The first one took me 4-1/2 hours! My fault, not the action's. I didn't know there was a trick to reinstalling the gate detent spring... The second gun took about 30 minutes...

One last word of advise, should you decide to tackle this project yourself. Be sure you reinsert the cylinder base pin (less the cylinder) all the way when you try the action... The tip of the base pin engages the transfer bar preventing it from hanging up on the exposed end of the firing pin. I knew this, but forgot it, which led to some frustration and delay until I reassembled the first gun.

If you think you like your Ruger's now... You'll absolutely love them after this upgrade.

I have three .44mag Vaqueros and two .45LC Vaqueros and all five of them shoot low and to the left. I've switched hands and used bench rest support and came to the conclusion it's the revolvers. As Mike indicated, different loads hit in different places, but I don't want to be dictated as to a specific load so I've switched to adjustable sighted revolvers.

Many folks after using Ruger Blackhawks have come to the conclusion that Ruger makes a good "starters kit".

Dan

I have a bird's head vaquerro in 45LC which also shoots low. At 25 yds from a rest on a 25 yd slow fire pistol taget it is not even on the paper. It's going back to Ruger. If they can't fix it, it's for sale!
jack

Easy fix, file down the front sight to bring up the point of impact. Don't do this till you've settled on a load, though, and go slow.

I had a '58 Remington Uberti that had an action job and eventually a Kirst conversion cylinder. When shooting cap and ball I noticed that 22 grains of 3F was the most accurate load, but the BP substitute was harder to ignite and would blow the caps off every time. I bought the conversion cylinder and had it fitted to my gun for extra measure, and I tell you that I could not miss with it! I was never able to get a holster made for it though, thus it was slow on the draw. I didn't learn enough about BP and the alternatives until later, so it may shoot C&B just fine using GOEX. For me it was the best shootin' iron I've had, but economics and bad health forced me to sell it. Try using real black powder or even the stix (NOT the pellets!) if available. The ignition point is very different among the sunbnstitues, and that may play a role in where your gun is hitting. Take a look at the conversion cylinder made for it as well, and remember that the Pietta's and Uberti's are not the same dimensions even if they look exactly the same. I prefer Kirst, and if you give them a call it's a good chance Mr. Kirst will speak to you himself. This is not to say R&D doesn't make good conversion cylindars; they do, it's just a matter of preference.
I'm new here but figured this was as good a place to jump in as any.
I have a friend that has a Vaquero and he doesn't like it because it doesn't shoot where he wants it to. He shot about half a box out of it the day we went and got it and he hasn't shot it since. I told him that I would buy it from him and he said he would trade it to me but hasn't figured out what he's wanting to trade for yet...lol.
I bought an 1858 Remington cap&ball revolver replica quite a while back and my two hunting/shooting buddies can't hit with it at all but I can, so I guess it's mostly in the grip and load combo. With light loads it shoots off but with full charge loads it hits to POA for me. It most definitely takes a different grip/hold than my autos or my DA revolvers!
Hope some of that made at least a little bit of sense. :confused: ;)

I recently bought a Ruger Birds head from a CAS buddy, and then I realized that the barrel was the shorter version much like Cimmaron's new model sheriff. I sold the latter because I couldn't hit squat with it, and thought it'd be the same with the Ruger, but not so. You can get slimmer grips or even shape the ones you have to get a better feel, but you are losing just a tiny amount of velocity from the shorter barrel. That may or may not help you, but filing down the front sight (slowly!) is also an excellent way to tailor your gun to shoot POA every time, as MikeG pointed out. Hope this helps.
I have a bird's head vaquerro in 45LC which also shoots low. At 25 yds from a rest on a 25 yd slow fire pistol taget it is not even on the paper. It's going back to Ruger. If they can't fix it, it's for sale!
jack

PS-If you are here in Texas and still want to sell your birds head, let me know!

I have heard of this with other's also but no one has said that they were using 255gr 45lc factory loads , which is what it should be sighted in for ! JAGG